ROP ESADT 2013-01-24 AC Chat

  Gisella Gruber-White:Welcome to the ESADT call on Thursday 24 January 2013 at 1400 UTC
  Gisella Gruber-White:Agenda: https://community.icann.org/x/NIZZAg
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:I can hear :-)
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:but I am indeed waiting for my dial-out
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:on now
  Eduardo Diaz:¡Hola a todos! - I will be able to attend for just half hour
  Gisella Gruber-White:Avri Doria has joined the AC Room
  Gisella Gruber-White:Please MUTE YOUR SPEAKERS
  Avri Doria:re 27.7. Not happy, but silenced for now.
  Avri Doria:27.8 F seems quirky
  Gisella Gruber-White:Hi Avri - are you on the AC audio
  Avri Doria:yep
  Avri Doria:you are leaving .8f as is?  Silliness enshrined.
  Avri Doria:instead of .8f as is, you should just run 3 again.
  Dev Anand Teelucksingh:27.a there is mention of BSPC - should this be BSMPC ?
  Dev Anand Teelucksingh:argh, sorry 28.a
  Avri Doria:Dev, do you mean 27.8a
  Dev Anand Teelucksingh:goodness, indeed I meant 27.8a - BSPC should be BMSPC
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Officers appointed by the ALAC: ExCom officers; NomCom; ccNSO & GNSO liaisons, but NOT SSAC Liaison where the final choice is made by SSAC
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:but I do not think we need to list an exhaustive list of what "ALAC Officers" are
  Avri Doria:SSAC maintains the right to reject laisions?  What a great idea!
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:SSAC makdes its choice from a number of candidate we forward to them
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:because any SSAC liaison becomes a full member of the SSAC due to the sensitivity of their work
  Avri Doria:also a good idea as a general case.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Should we say "Public ALAC List per guidelines on what list to use in Section XYZ" ???
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:so as to remove the ambiguity of using "Public ALAC List" ?
  Dev Anand Teelucksingh:wouldn't public ALAC list be the defintions section?
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:because I fear that "Public ALAC List" is defined elsewhere as being the ALAC working list
  Dev Anand Teelucksingh:at the beginning of the RoP ?
  Avri Doria:Shouldn't it be a public At-Large list?
  Dev Anand Teelucksingh:and ALAC Public and ALAC working be properly defined
  Avri Doria:Such events should have as wide on announcement as possible.
  Avri Doria:so as large a segment of At-Large might be informed and able to comment on their reps being eleiminated.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:it's the "discussion" part which should be on internal list
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:because ti relates to people
  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:yes only the discussion
  Avri Doria:but if it relates to representatives, it must be transparent/
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:so if a discussion is slanderous to you Avri, would you like this to be on the public list?
  Avri Doria:secret kanals to remove an unpolular person should not be allowed.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:(hypothetically of course)
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond::-)
  Avri Doria:s/kanals/kabals/
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:It is not a secret canal. It's privacy.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Just like NomCOm discussions about candidates
  Avri Doria:yes, if i can going to slanderd, i want it done in publoic so i can repsond and others can repsond.  also makes people more careful about the slanfder they sling.  slinging slander in provate is easy, doing it in public is risky.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:what you consider slanderous others might consider the truth
  Avri Doria:this is different, this is removing people who already made themselves ublic by accepting the job.
  Alan Greenberg:Suggested 27.1: For any regular term, the timing of the process described in this section must meet the ICANN Bylaw Article VI, Section 8(1.f) and 8(4) requirement to provide written notice of the person selected to the Secretary of ICANN no later than six months before the conclusion of ICANN's annual meeting in 2014 and each ICANN annual meeting every third year after 2014.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:they should not be worried about saying what they have to say because of the threat of lander
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:lander -> slander
  Avri Doria:this is a deviation frm accountability and transparency standards.
  Avri Doria:insiders keeping secrets has to be stopped.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:how?
  Alan Greenberg:Full message and background in http://mm.icann.org/pipermail/alac-esadt/2013-January/000034.html
  Avri Doria:if an officer or other rep is to be removed for cause, that must be discussed in the public sphere.
  Avri Doria:dont accept the office it you are not willing to be impeached in public.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:some will disagree with you. Vehemently.
  Avri Doria:people with things to hide?
  Avri Doria:i guess we have very different stnadards of accountability and transparency.  you seem to give precendence to privacy for elected officials.  i think a notion like that is dangerous.  one gives up privacy when they become public people.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:people who care about their reputation, although they might have been having poor performance in this universe
  Avri Doria:serves at the will of the At-Large
  Avri Doria:I disagree strongly.  
  Avri Doria:volunters should be subject to the same accountablity and transparency standards as any officer anywhere.
  Silvia Vivanco:@ Yrjo: Could you please state the AI as you would like it recorded.
  Alan Greenberg:Avri, A&T. Definitely. But not necessarily public hangings
  Avri Doria:I could not disagree more.
  Avri Doria:you exagerate and turn this into FUD.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Avri -- it has happened.
  Avri Doria:people who are willing to take repsonsiblity and the privs that come with it, must be willing to take reprobation
  Eduardo Diaz:What is FUD?
  Heidi Ullrich:fear, uncertainty and doubt
  Avri Doria:Fear uncertainlty and doubt  - the content of som many arguments about the bad things that might happen.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:what is the acronym for things that actually HAVE happened? FUBAR?
  Avri Doria:even most of those are exagerrated by the status quoists.
  Eduardo Diaz:@Yrjo: Gracias to you.
  Heidi Ullrich:Thanks to all!
  Eduardo Diaz:Bye
  Avri Doria:as someone who was never allowed into the team.  i thank you for allowing me to attend and speak.
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Thanks everyone
  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:@Avri: "never allowed into the team" ? Now that's FUD