Mario Aleman:Welcome to the LACRALO Governance Working Group Call on Thursday, 21 September 2017 at 18:00 UTC
Mario Aleman:Draft agenda: : https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_x_HS8hB&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=EIZsRD5HkaWrY-IOAapEBdyRwuZLXAVNnDN6t_SaXlQ&m=rUmzOlehmhxl00xp6aS41w2mPll9HESOTt4DGFqPpDc&s=s_9_lJBcPuIBvc0LNo64CIuYdqd7h0a-42YAoiTn2Rg&e=
Mario Aleman:Hello Dev, welcome to the call
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:hello
Silvia Vivanco:Hello all
Silvia Vivanco:I will join in 3 mins finishing another call
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Hello
Silvia Vivanco:Hello all
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Am ok with anything
Mario Aleman:Welcome everyone
Mario Aleman:Bienvenidos todos
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Wow, re: Maritza
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:that's far!
Aida Noblia:Hola ! pude acceder al adobe
Mario Aleman:Bienvenida Aida
Aida Noblia:gracias Mario
Silvia Vivanco:ahora si
Carlton Samuels:Hello everybody
sergio salinas porto:hi carlton! & Dev!
Silvia Vivanco:Welcome Carlton
Humberto Carrasco:hello everybody
Carlton Samuels:Howdy Sergio. Long time
Silvia Vivanco:Welcome Jacqueline !
Jacqueline Morris:HI everyone!
Jacqueline Morris:Thanks Silvia
Silvia Vivanco:Action Items of last call: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__community.icann.org_display_LACRALO_Action-2BItems-2BES-253A-2B2017-2D06-2D12-2BLACRALO-2BGovernance-2BWorking-2BGroup-2BCall&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=EIZsRD5HkaWrY-IOAapEBdyRwuZLXAVNnDN6t_SaXlQ&m=rUmzOlehmhxl00xp6aS41w2mPll9HESOTt4DGFqPpDc&s=mMqDDNRNPEfAPmFAze_oNb_nAhWMiS42mkFkq9L26aI&e=
Mario Aleman:Welcome to the call, Melissa
Malisa Richards:Thank you Mario
Malisa Richards:Greetings all
Carlton Samuels:@Dev: +1. The GA is a meeting for decision-making on policy etc. Regular monthly meetings are just that!
Jacqueline Morris:I agree with Dev's definition.
Carlton Samuels:Every time a decision is to be made that requires the input of ALL members on a resolution, then it is a GA.
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:+1 Carlton, indeed
Carlton Samuels:@Alberto: We are agreed.
Malisa Richards:+1 I agree with Dev's decision
Silvia Vivanco:Google doc with the document is posted on the agenda: https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__docs.google.com_document_d_1dH4loMd10HSjfmgbDs7x0zBNfYd-5FlsKv6mXfIBoMYvU_edit-23heading-3Dh.xw4kjselpneg&d=DwIFaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=EIZsRD5HkaWrY-IOAapEBdyRwuZLXAVNnDN6t_SaXlQ&m=rUmzOlehmhxl00xp6aS41w2mPll9HESOTt4DGFqPpDc&s=939Cl4q-asfSAEfuXqm40QWJDDB0m5BXpnbRGkKwBZU&e=
Carlton Samuels:The subject is not the driver for the meeting to be an assembly. An assembly is a meeting for decision-making that requires the entire membership to participate.
sergio salinas porto:dev, yo tambien escribiré algo sobre asambleas para que quede documentado
sergio salinas porto:@dev eso se vera en reglas de procedimiento
Jacqueline Morris:Carlton puts it as I understand it.
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:@Carlton - that to me sounds like a good defintion of assembly - An assembly is a meeting for decision-making that requires the entire membership to participate.
Carlton Samuels:@Alberto: +1 a WG should not be included in definition for assembly
Malisa Richards:Carlton has defined it simply and to the point
Jacqueline Morris:@Carlton - yes, I agree. I don't see how the WG comes into it at all.
Malisa Richards:I disagree with the WG being included in the definition of the assembly
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:agree, WG don't need to be defined with the definition of assembly
sergio salinas porto:@malisa, @Carlton, @ Jacqueline era solo una idea...no creo que sea central en lo que estamos tratando
Silvia Vivanco:The working group normally is more flexible
Carlton Samuels:The conceptual base is ordinary and extraordinary. In general terms we are committed to an annual decision-making meeting; the general assembly. When we have more than one called in any year that is the extraordinary one.
Humberto Carrasco:de acuerdo
Humberto Carrasco:i agree sergio
Jacqueline Morris:@Sergio - OK. I think that a general Assembly is a meeting of ALL members to make decisions. Regular is a regularly scheduled one. Extraordinary one - called for an extraordinay purpose.
Jacqueline Morris:Yes - I agree
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:so three categories : monthly meeting, regular assembly and extraordinary assembly
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:sure I agree
Aida Noblia:de acuerdo
sergio salinas porto:ok tendriamos tres: Reunion Mensual, Asamblea ordinaria y Asamblea extraordinaria
Malisa Richards:I agree with Jacqueline
Jacqueline Morris:So we can define Mnthly meeting as regular monthly business meeting, to discuss activity, etc. Ordinary General Assembly - a regularly scheduled meeting (e.g. Annual) to make decisions with the participation of ALL members. Extraordinary - a GA called out of the regular time to make decisions on matters that are urgent or extreordinary.
Jacqueline Morris:Absolutely we should allow individual members. The question is the structure or process by which these indvidual members are incorporated into the RALO structure.
Silvia Vivanco:AFRALO is also accepting individual members now :)
Silvia Vivanco:so 4 RALOs
Jacqueline Morris:Teamwork? I don't understand how individual membership is against teamwork.
Carlton Samuels:We should allow individual users no question. Furthermore, the individual should be accommodated for full membership with all the responsibilities, rights and benefits
Silvia Vivanco:si es en EURALO it is the "Individual Members Association"
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:We can have individuals in a virtual ALS for each country
Malisa Richards:I believe that accepting indivisual members will aid in the multistakeholder model that ICANN is using. Hence Individual membership will also contribute in achieving the objetives of LACRALO
Jacqueline Morris:That's a good idea, Dev
Carlton Samuels:@Dev: Good idea for valorizing input
Jacqueline Morris:That can also aid in outreach and getting more members and paricipation.
Malisa Richards:To add to what Jacqueline says it will also assist with the outreach process of LACRALO
Humberto Carrasco:i believe We should accept individual member,but only with voice. Without voting rights now. We need a transition period
Aida Noblia:se oye mal
Silvia Vivanco:No te pudimos escuchar hacia el final
Silvia Vivanco:entrecortado al fina;
Carlton Samuels:@Sergio: We understand that concern. So the best way to end the political issue is a virtual ALS in every country where there is an individual. Regardless of the number of individuals in any country, they collectively have the same influence when it comes to decision-making.
Silvia Vivanco:We can call you
Jacqueline Morris:Without full rights, there is no voice, Humberto.
Silvia Vivanco:please number Sergio
sergio salinas porto:+5492235215819
Malisa Richards:@Humberto, if we are to limit individual members then there will be a skew on some decisions which we see happening from time to time.
Carlton Samuels:And it gives all the ALS in every country an opporunity to mount an outreach effort to bring that pperson or persons into the fold of an existing ALS.
Humberto Carrasco:i disagree Jacqueline
Jacqueline Morris:So how can someone have a voice without rights? I'd love to understand that model.
Jacqueline Morris:HUmberto - can you explain voice without rights?
Silvia Vivanco:ahora si
Carlton Samuels:@Humberto: I am very uncomfortable with any idea that says full participation with ALL responsibilities BUT restrict rights. Sound too much like apartheid for my stomach.
Malisa Richards:@Humberto, in essence are you saying that individual users would just basically have an observer status?
Jacqueline Morris:I do not understand how anyone would want to join to do work, but without rights.
Humberto Carrasco:i will talk by phone to explano my point
Jacqueline Morris:I do not suggest the ending of the ALS model, but I think teh virtual ALS model has worked in other RALOs, and I see no reason why it cannot work here.
Carlton Samuels:This position reminds me of Animal Farm's "all animals are equal but some are more equal than others".
Jacqueline Morris:I didn't see how individual users being allowed means that ALSes are to be destroyed.
Malisa Richards:I strongly believe that the virtual ALS model in LACRALO will contribute significantly especially in the area of outreach and membership
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Indeed, re: Animal Farm analogy
Carlton Samuels:@Jaqueline: The virtal ALS accomodate all the concerns. A virtual ALS in each country with a individual user(s) is the model that accomodates the interests of all.
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Virtual ALS per country will accomodate your worry, Humberto
Jacqueline Morris:That is now what is being suggested, though. Individuals would be participating in a Virtual ALS.
Jacqueline Morris:Not individual users having a vote each.
Carlton Samuels:@Sergio: I disagree. The ALS will always have work. The principal reason for ALS is outreach. And if you ask ICANN it is outreach using the ALS own resources. That does not go away.
Carlton Samuels:@Alberto: I agree with you the ITEMS position to its logical conclusion is elimination of ALS. We do not support that position. We beleive we can accommodate individuals withing the ALS structure. Other RALOs have done so. We can too in LACRALO.
Jacqueline Morris:Yes, exactly.
sergio salinas porto:houston estamos en un problema
Carlton Samuels:@Sergio: :-)
Alberto Soto:Yes Cartn
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:yes, we can jacqueline
Carlton Samuels:@Jacqueline: +1 to everything said!
Malisa Richards:+1 @Jacqueline
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:+1 Jacqueline
Humberto Carrasco:evebody agrees We need individual users. Now, We need to find the way
Carlton Samuels:I cannot understand why another ALS in a country, virtual or not, is going to be a problem!
Jacqueline Morris:Maybe... I will try
Aida Noblia:la mayoría acepta que participen usuarios individuales, unos con voto otros sin voto
Malisa Richards:I'll try to attend
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:I can also try to attend
Jacqueline Morris:I usually am at UWI with my thesis adviser, but I will try to meet him in the morning.
Humberto Carrasco:can We have a doodle?
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Yes, am ok, but if others want a doodle - important to keep the discussion going
Carlton Samuels:@Humberto: I'm happy to see you on the yes side. Alberto understands why it is necessary. We must convince our friend Sergio he will not lose anything from having a virtual ALS.
Aida Noblia:la mayoría aceptan hoy la partiipación de usuarios individuales
sergio salinas porto:malisa esta en nuestro canal?
Aida Noblia:tomar el modelo de las RALOS que los aceptan puede ser una solución
Jacqueline Morris:Aida, having some with votes and some not is very troubling to me. It's very much like a segregation plan. And any suggestion of that is very disturbing to people from a history of slavery/apartheid.
Carlton Samuels:I'm on the audio bridge via Skype. I can hear everybody but nobody hears me! Its not just on LACRALO calls. Every call. Helluva thing!
Aida Noblia:ok JAC
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Indeed, Jacqueline
Carlton Samuels:Thank you all. Vigourous discussion always welcome.
Jacqueline Morris:OK - thanks. Adios everyone.
Aida Noblia:BYE ALL
Dev Anand Teelucksingh:Thanks everyone - take care all