FINAL VERSION SUBMITTED (IF RATIFIED)
The final version to be submitted, if the draft is ratified, will be placed here by upon completion of the vote.
FINAL DRAFT VERSION TO BE VOTED UPON BY THE ALAC
The final draft version to be voted upon by the ALAC will be placed here before the vote is to begin.
The ALAC appreciates the opportunity to comment on the proposed Travel Support Guidelines.
At-Large is unique within the ICANN Community in that virtually all volunteers in At-Large activities including those involving travel do so as true volunteers. None do so in support of their employers, few are employed by what could be considered the domain name industry or in activities supporting it, and many are not even employed in jobs supporting the Internet.
Without ICANN travel support the number of At-Large attendees at meetings would be a small number indeed. That is in contrast to much of the rest of the ICANN community, who regularly attended ICANN meetings and events before there was any general ICANN travel funding.
Our comments are general organized following the Draft Community Travel Support Guidelines document and most comments will be preceded by the Section title and page.
Travel Assistance and Support, Page 6
The last sentence says there are DISCRETIONARY travel costs that are not supported. The dictionary defines discretionary as “optional, voluntary or elective”. There are non-discretionary expenses which travelers incur which are not reimbursable and for which per diems are not sufficient. The Guidelines must be accurate and clear.
Community Responsibilities, Page 7
This section lists time limits in days, not specifying if they are calendar days or work days (and if the latter, whose work days as they vary over the world). In at least some cases, the designated Travel Management Company does not operate on weekends. Travelers should be given the same courtesy having non-work days treated in a similar manner to how they are treated for ICANN staff and contractors.
Wire Transfer and FX Fees/Losses, Page 9
ICANN uses wire transfers because it is the most practical and presumably the cheapest way for ICANN to distribute per diems and reimbursements. Setting the limit for reimbursements at $50 per transfer (which could easily exceed 10% of the amount transferred) is not reasonable. All fees that can be demonstrated to be paid should be reimbursable or for regular travelers added to the amount transferred. At worst, travelers should be allowed to accumulate such fees and request reimbursement when they exceed a threshold (such as $50 or the $100 minimum for transfers described in the section on Deferred Payments.
Travel Insurance, Page 9
We suggest that the wording be changed to make it clear that travel insurance is the traveler’s responsibility. Specifically “ICANN does not provide any travel insurance for travelers. ICANN will reimburse travel insurance expenses only if required to apply for visa. To be reimbursed, the supported traveler must provide proof that the insurance is required.”
Travel by the Numbers, Page 10
It is unclear why the split of 0.4 : 0.4 : 0.2 is shown here. In the last, we have been told that we can split a slot with Air to one person and Hotel and Per Diem to another person. Does providing this table mean that in the future, we will be able to divide the total slot in other ways (such as including the Per Diem with Air, of fund three different travelers each getting one component of the slot? Or since they are both 0.4, we can provide two Airs and one Per Diem with a slot?
Clarity on what we may and may not do (and maybe even explaining why) would be appreciated.
Shared Funding for a Supported Traveler, Page 10
Air and other miscellaneous expenses are paid by the group that is funding the longest stay and Hotel and meal allowance can be split.
For most community travels are provided with a Per Diem to cover meals and other expenses such as local transfers. What are the “miscellaneous expenses” that are bundled with Air?
Approved Dates of Arrival and Departure, Page 10
ICANN regularly requires that a traveller take flights that arrive late at night, often after a very long trip, and the traveler is expected to be present and alert early the next morning - at times with the expected (and reasonable) result that they do not make their first meeting. If a traveler has an early morning start to meetings and the only practical flights available have late arrivals, arrival the previous day should be allowed.
ICANN quite reasonably will book a hotel room for the night prior to arrival if the flight is due to arrive quite early in the morning. But if a traveler prefers to take a flight that allows them to arrive in time to sleep in the same room for the entire night, it is not allowed. Something such as this which allows a modicum of comfort to the traveler at no cost to ICANN should be allowed.
Special Circumstances, Page 12
Presumably the reference to providing additional financial support for a single trip means a single RETURN trip.
Reimbursement, Page 12
In some cases, the $200 limit is not reasonable. Visa costs can be quite expensive, and courier fees along, which are often mandatory, can easily exceed this amount. ICANN claims it wants to be inclusive and encourage diversity. The CCWG-Accountability WS2 recommendations reinforce this. Travel Guidelines have to be realistic about the costs incurred in parts of the world and not limit them to costs that are reasonable in Western developed countries.
ICANN-Arranged Travel, Page 13.
This method ensures the lowest trip cost and allows ICANN Travel Support to manage the security and well-being of supported travelers.
This sounds very good and the ALAC understands that the implication is that if a professional travel provider establishes the itinerary, then that will be better for the traveler’s security and well-being.
But the reality is that these itineraries provided by Travel Support do not always meet this standard. Layovers may be very long (10-12 hours), but if they occur during day hours (in the physical location if not the travelers biological time), no day-room or similar accommodation is provided.
Itineraries must also be effective from the traveler’s point of view, and not just lowest cost.
Moreover, ICANN has at times demonstrated itself to be particularly insensitive to travelers with physical disabilities or special needs, and that is not acceptable, particularly when it is done for minimal savings at a significant cost in time, inconvenience or pain to the traveler.
Self-Arranged Travel, Page 13
The ALAC appreciates that self-arranged travel is allowed for. However, for travelers who may choose to do so, it would be far preferable to allow them to request a blanket approval for such travel and not make them request it each time, having to wait for approval to be “granted” prior to making air arrangements. Unless there are cases where such permission will be refused for regular travelers, why place the extra impediment in the way, causing delays for the traveler and extra work for ICANN staff? Of course, such travel will be reimbursed ONLY if the traveler is actually approved for that meeting and that should be part of the blanket approval conditions.
At-Large travelers have been told that Self-Arranged Travel is available only for ICANN meetings and not for, for example, CROP trips. If that is indeed the case, it should be explicitly stated. The section on Maximum Reimbursable Fares implies that this is not the case (or perhaps will not be the case once these guidelines are in effect).
Although the maximum reimbursable airfare is based on a nonrefundable economy class ticket, supported travelers may purchase any type of fare and any class of service, as long as the fare is under the maximum reimbursable fare for their region.
Is this accurate, or is it the case that a traveler may purchase a ticket at any cost but will only be reimbursed the Maximum fare specified? Certainly in the last it was the latter.
Reimbursement for Self-Arranged Travel, Page 14
There is no excuse for a travel expense to take 50-60 days after approval for payment. Surely ICANN has sufficiently advanced financial systems so as to pay creditors, including volunteers in a timelier manner.
Preferred Travel Itinerary, Page 14
In cities which ostensibly have more than one large airport, there can be very significant cost (both financial and time) to the traveler in selecting one airport over another. This must be factored into itinerary selection.
Business Class Travel, Page 14
It is appreciated that ICANN provides business class travel to those who volunteer to lead out SOs and ACs. However, the same courtesy and message of appreciation should be extended to those who Chair ICANN Specific Reviews. These Bylaw-mandated reviews (formerly Affirmation of Commitments Reviews) require a very significant time and effort commitment and should be similarly treated.
Consideration should also be given to extending the same courtesy to selected Cross-Community working groups. The IANA Stewardship Transition and Accountability CCWG are two such examples where the Chair or Co-Chair commitments were indeed impressive and should be recognized.
Unauthorized Dates of Arrival or Departure, Page 15
On page 6, in the section on the Purpose of Travel Support it says:
When travel support is economical and feasible, ICANN can support the maximum number of travelers.
Yet, in this section it says that early arrival or late departure will not be allowed, even if the net cost to ICANN factoring in hotel and other costs) is less. It is appreciated that ICANN does not want to be seen as providing free vacations to its volunteers. But if ICANN’s designated Travel Management Company certifies that there is a net savings, at times a savings of several thousand dollars from allowing a traveler to arrive early or leave late, and the traveler is willing to extend their travel away from work and family, what is the possible justification for not availing ICANN of the savings.
To be clear, this is not a hypothetical question. There are demonstrable cases) one of them as recent as the ICANN62 meeting) where travel on the assigned dates would cost ICANN thousands of dollars more, but the ICANN decision was to pay the higher fare unless the traveler was willing to pay for their own hotels room and other costs for several days (and of course, ended up working on ICANN matters and not taking the time off).
Rail Travel, Page 17
It is not reasonable to deny a traveler first class rail travel, which is often the only way to obtain a reserved seat (something that ICANN will pay for with air travel), when such travel is under the minimum cost of economy air travel. The ability to have a reserved seat is a minimum requirement.
It is similarly unreasonable to not allow a traveler to book their own rail travel and be reimbursed.
Early Check-In and Late Check-Out, Page 18
In many parts of the world, very late night departures are common. A traveler may well have had to check out of their room early in the day and then wait for a flight that might leave well after midnight. ICANN should at the least provide one or more rooms which a traveler can reserve for a period of time to shower and change cloths before departing on a long-haul journey late at night. The cost to ICANN would be low and the benefit to travelers great.
Ground Transportation, Page 21
It is understood that Per Diems are INTENDED to cover any ground transportation, but in cases where home-airport travel is demonstrably more expensive than the norm, it must be reimbursable.
Per Diem, Page 22
For travel to other approved ICANN events, ICANN Travel Support confirms the per diem amount via email.
If this is supposed to be the current case, it is broken, as it does not happen, at least in some cases.
At one point, ICANN notified travelers by e-mail whenever a Per Diem was transferred, giving the details (number of days, daily amount and value in the currency on the recipient). This happened sporadically and stopped several years ago. It should be reinstated as it makes it crystal clear to the traveler what is happening.
For years, Per Diems were transferred in the traveler’s preferred currency (as ICANN does for any vendor). That stopped several months ago (at least for some travelers).
General Comments
ICANN and its designated Travel Management Company should be subject to service level commitments. At times the response from Constituency Travel and Travel Management Company is absolutely fabulous. And at other times it takes DAYs to get a simple answer.
Related to this, the designated Travel Management Company should be given the discretion to ticket itineraries that are within certain guidelines without having to wait for Constituency Travel approval, which at times can take days. ICANN should contract with a firm it trusts, periodically audit it and not need to intervene in every case.
Typo:
Communications Responsibilities, Page 7, Numbered item 4: ICANN travel Support sends a FOURTH email.
DRAFT SUBMITTED FOR DISCUSSION
The first draft submitted will be placed here before the call for comments begins. The Draft should be preceded by the name of the person submitting the draft and the date/time. If, during the discussion, the draft is revised, the older version(S) should be left in place and the new version along with a header line identifying the drafter and date/time should be placed above the older version(s), separated by a Horizontal Rule (available + Insert More Content control).
Posted by Alan Greenberg, 11 July 018
The ALAC appreciates the opportunity to comment on the proposed Travel Support Guidelines.
At-Large is unique within the ICANN Community in that virtually all volunteers in At-Large activities including those involving travel do so as true volunteers. None do so in support of their employers, few are employed by what could be considered the domain name industry or in activities supporting it, and many are not even employed in jobs supporting the Internet.
Without ICANN travel support the number of At-Large attendees at meetings would be a small number indeed. That is in contrast to much of the rest of the ICANN community, who regularly attended ICANN meetings and events before there was any general ICANN travel funding.
Our comments are general organized following the Draft Community Travel Support Guidelines document and most comments will be preceded by the Section title and page.
Travel Assistance and Support, Page 6
The last sentence says there are DISCRETIONARY travel costs that are not supported. The dictionary defines discretionary as “optional, voluntary or elective”. There are non-discretionary expenses which travelers incur which are not reimbursable and for which per diems are not sufficient. The Guidelines must be accurate and clear.
Community Responsibilities
This section lists time limits in days, not specifying if they are calendar days or work days (and if the latter, whose work days as they vary over the world). In at least some cases, the designated Travel Management Company does not operate on weekend. Travelers should be given the same courtesy
Wire Transfer and FX Fees/Losses, Page 9
ICANN uses wire transfers because it is the most practical and presumably the cheapest way for ICANN to distribute per diems and reimbursements. Setting the limit for reimbursements at $50 per transfer (which could easily exceed 10% of the amount transferred) is not reasonable. All fees that can be demonstrated to be paid should be reimbursable or for regular travelers added to the amount transferred. At worst, travelers should be allowed to accumulate such fees and request reimbursement when they exceed a threshold (such as $50 or the $100 minimum for transfers described in the section on Deferred Payments.
Travel by the Numbers, Page 10
It is unclear why the split of 0.4 : 0.4 : 0.2 is shown here. In the last, we have been told that we can split a slot with Air to one person and Hotel and Per Diem to another person. Does providing this table mean that in the future, we will be able to divide the total slot in other ways (such as including the Per Diem with Air, of fund three different travelers each getting one component of the slot? Or since they are both 0.4, we can provide two Airs and one Per Diem with a slot?
Clarity on what we may and may not do (and maybe even explaining why) would be appreciated.
Shared Funding for a Supported Traveler, Page 10
Air and other miscellaneous expenses are paid by the group that is funding the longest stay and Hotel and meal allowance can be split.
For most community travels are provided with a Per Diem to cover meals and other expenses such as local transfers. What are the “miscellaneous expenses” that are bundled with Air?
Approved Dates of Arrival and Departure, Page 10
ICANN regularly requires that a traveller take flights that arrive late at night, often after a very long trip, and the traveler is expected to be present and alert early the next morning - at times with the expected (and reasonable) result that they do not make their first meeting. If a traveler has an early morning start to meetings and the only practical flights available have late arrivals, arrival the previous day should be allowed.
ICANN quite reasonably will book a hotel room for the night prior to arrival if the flight is due to arrive quite early in the morning. But if a traveler prefers to take a flight that allows them to arrive in time to sleep in the same room for the entire night, it is not allowed. Something such as this which allows a modicum of comfort to the traveler at no cost to ICANN should be allowed.
Special Circumstances, Page 12
Presumably the reference to providing additional financial support for a single trip means a single RETURN trip.
Reimbursement, Page 12
In some cases, the $200 limit is not reasonable. Visa costs can be quite expensive, and courier fees along, which are often mandatory, can easily exceed this amount. ICANN claims it wants to be inclusive and encourage diversity. The CCWG-Accountability WS2 recommendations reinforce this. Travel Guidelines have to be realistic about the costs incurred in parts of the world and not limit the m to costs that are reasonable in Western developed countries.
ICANN-Arranged Travel, Page 13.
This method ensures the lowest trip cost and allows ICANN Travel Support to manage the security and well-being of supported travelers.
This sound very good and the ALAC understands that the implication is that if professional travel provider establish the itinerary, then that will be better for the traveler’s security and well-being.
But the reality is that these itineraries provided by Travel Support do not meet this standard. Layovers may be very long (10-12 hours), but if they occur during day hours (in the physical location if not the travelers biological time), no day-room or similar accommodation is provided.
Moreover, ICANN has at times demonstrated itself to be particularly insensitive to travelers with disabilities or special needs, and that is not acceptable, particularly when it is done for minimal savings at a significant cost in time, inconvenience or pain to the traveler.
Self-Arranged Travel, Page 13
The ALAC appreciates that self-arranged travel is allowed for. However, for travelers who may choose to do so, it would be far preferable to allow them to request a blanket approval for such travel and not make them request it each time, having to wait for approval to be “granted” prior to making air arrangements. Unless there are cases where such permission will be refused for regular travelers, why place the extra impediment in the way, causing delays for the traveler and extra work for ICANN staff? Of course, such travel will be reimbursed ONLY if the traveler is actually approved for that meeting and that should be part of the blanket approval conditions.
At-Large travelers have been told that Self-Arranged Travel is available only for ICANN meetings and not for, for example, CROP trips. If that is indeed the case, it should be explicitly stated. The section on Maximum Reimbursable Fares implies that this is not the case (or perhaps will not be the case once these guidelines are in effect).
Although the maximum reimbursable airfare is based on a nonrefundable economy class ticket, supported travelers may purchase any type of fare and any class of service, as long as the fare is under the maximum reimbursable fare for their region.
Is this accurate, or is it the case that a traveler may purchase a ticket at any cost but will only be reimbursed the Maximum fare specified? Certainly in the last it was the latter.
Reimbursement for Self-Arranged Travel, Page 14
There is no excuse for a travel expense to take 50-60 days after approval for payment. Surely ICANN has sufficiently advanced financial systems so as to pay creditors, including volunteers in a timelier manner.
Business Class Travel, Page 14
It is appreciated that ICANN provides business class travel to those who volunteer to lead out SOs and ACs. However, the same courtesy and message of appreciation should be extended to those who Chair ICANN Specific Reviews. These Bylaw-mandated reviews (formerly Affirmation of Commitments Reviews) require a very significant time and effort commitment and should be similarly treated.
Consideration should also be given to extending the same courtesy to selected Cross-Community working groups. The IANA Stewardship Transition and Accountability CCWG are two such examples where the Chair or Co-Chair commitments were indeed impressive and should be recognized.
Unauthorized Dates of Arrival or Departure, Page 15
On page 6, in the section on the Purpose of Travel Support it says:
When travel support is economical and feasible, ICANN can support the maximum number of travelers.
Yet, in this section it says that early arrival or late departure will not be allowed, even if the net cost to ICANN factoring in hotel and other costs) is less. It is appreciated that ICANN does not want to be seen as providing free vacations to its volunteers. But if ICANN’s designated Travel Management Company certifies that there is a net savings, at times a savings of several thousand dollars from allowing a traveler to arrive early or leave late, and the traveler is willing to extend their travel away from work and family, what is the possible justification for not availing ICANN of the savings.
To be clear, this is not a hypothetical question. There are demonstrable cases) one of them as recent as the ICANN62 meeting) where travel on the assigned dates would cost ICANN thousands of dollars more, but the ICANN decision was to pay the higher fare unless the traveler was willing to pay for their own hotels room and other costs for several days (and of course, ended up working on ICANN matters and not taking the time off).
Rail Travel, Page 17
It is not reasonable to deny a traveler first class rail travel, which is often the only way to obtain a reserved seat (something that ICANN will pay for with air travel), when such travel is under the minimum cost of economy air travel. It is similarly unreasonable to not allow a traveler to book their own rail travel and be reimbursed.
Early Check-In and Late Check-Out, Page 18
In many parts of the world, very late night departures are common. A traveler may well have had to check out of their room early in the day and then wait for a flight that might leave well after midnight. ICANN should at the least provide one or more rooms which a traveler can reserve for a period of time to shower and change cloths before departing on a long-haul journey late at night. The cost to ICANN would be low and the benefit to travelers great.
Ground Transportation, Page 21
It is understood that Per Diems are INTENDED to cover any ground transportation, but in cases where home-airport travel is demonstrably more expensive than the norm, it must be reimbursable.
Per Diem, Page 22
For travel to other approved ICANN events, ICANN Travel Support confirms the per diem amount via email.
If this is supposed to be the current case, it is broken, as it does not happen, at least in some cases.
At one point, ICANN notified travelers by e-mail whenever a Per Diem was transferred, giving the details (number of days, daily amount and value in the currency on the recipient). This happened sporadically and stopped several years ago. It should be reinstated as it makes it crystal clear to the traveler what is happening.
For years, Per Diems were transferred in the traveler’s preferred currency (as ICANN does for any vendor). That stopped several months ago (at least for some travelers).
General Comments
ICANN and its designated Travel Management Company should be subject to service level commitments. At times the response from Constituency Travel and Travel Management Company is absolutely fabulous. And at other times it takes DAYs to get a simple answer.
Related to this, the designated Travel Management Company should be given the discretion to ticket itineraries that are within certain guidelines without having to wait for Constituency Travel approval, which at times can take days. ICANN should contract with a firm it trusts, periodically audit it and not need to intervene in every case.
Typo:
Communications Responsibilities, Page 7, Numbered item 4: ICANN travel Support sends a FOURTH email.
74 Comments
Eduardo Diaz
Two comments.
The rest of the document seems to cover all aspects of ICANN travel.
-ed
Alfredo Calderon
The document complies with all Travel expectations. I do feel that the section on "Travel by Numbers" needs clarification. The decimal number distribution seems to imply that some criteria must be met in each cathegory when a candidate is requesting travel, but it's not clear.
Alan Greenberg
Agreed that it needs clarity.
As I read it, the text below the table says we cannot use a "slot" from ICANN62 for any other meeting (as an example).
The relevance of the table MIGHT mean we can split a single slot into its compenents and give to three different people (in the past we have been told it could only be split as travel and hotel/per diem. It might also mean that we can trade off travel and lodging and air travel since they are both 0.4 (that is, take one slot and provide two air travels and a per diem). I suspect that latter is not a proper interpretation.
Alan Greenberg
From page 16.
If I am reading this correctly (and it matches what CT has been doing), If you can save ICANN money by coming a day early, or leaving a day later with a much lower airfare (MORE than covering the cost of the hotel and per diem), you are not allowed to do that.
Yet on page 6 it says:
How can this be justified?
Alan Greenberg
Among other things, I would like to see a service level commitment on how quickly one can expect a reply to a message to CT or to FCM.
Judith Hellerstein
Alan Greenberg I agree with you . We should be able to come earlier and save money. We should also be able to split the spot or combine them. So in Puerto Rico when we had 2 flight components but no hotel we should have been able to combine them and have a full slot. Also we might look at sharing rooms so that we could bring and fund more people. I would be happy ti help with the drafting of this. I also think that ICANN should look into which communitiess fly business and why.
Alan Greenberg
Two thoughts:
Alan Greenberg
I support the exception that AC/SO Chairs travel in business class. They step up to a BIG job and deserve it (and I say that as someone who is leaving such a post and would not be a future beneficiary).
I do not understand why the same courtesy is not extended to Chairs of groups such as Review Teams. They take on a huge responsibility which is supposedly crucial to ICANN and I believe are due the same level of courtesy. And we are talking on the average, about one person per year for several trips. I also believe that we should have a provision for doing the same for SOME CCWG chairs. Although not all have the same level of commitment and impact, there should be a way to provide it for those that do.
Judith Hellerstein
I would support giving them funding but not sure anyone should be allowed to travel business. I would suggest that they get premium economy but not business.
Alfredo Calderon
Alan Greenberg and Judith Hellerstein make good points on the travel savings that can be obtained by traveling early to some events/meetings. Could it be possible that travel staff evaluates and presents scenarios where earlier arrival generates savings? I understand this might great more work for staff, but is it not part of what is stated on page 6:
"CANN and supported travelers must demonstrate fiscal responsibility and strike a balance between the benefits of travel and budgetary constraints. When travel support is economical and feasible ICANN can support the maximum number of travelers."
On the upgrades on airfares, could it be feasible to have in place an option to have the traveler, pay the difference to travel business? A procedure could be in place to allow willing travelers to pay the difference; especially when flight time exceeds 4 or 5 hours or traveler has some outstanding health condition.
Under the "Self-Arranged Travel" it would be reasonable to have an expected reply time of the requested travel arrangements.
Judith Hellerstein
Under self arranged, ICANN gives you a certain amount of money you can spend on your flight. You are not reimbursed until after the ICANN meeting. People who fly business use this method as they can get more of their flight covered since you can spend up to the max allowed.
Alfredo Calderon
@Judith, Thanks for clarification.
Glenn McKnight
If you book very early you can obtain much cheaper flights. The delays by CT in confirmation in the travel period ends up having the higher cost. I have situations where the business class ticket to LA was cheaper than the economy ticket when it would have been book well in advance.
G
Judith Hellerstein
Visas-The attached document states that Supported travelers must have all visas at least two weeks before the start of an ICANN Public Meeting or approved ICANN event; otherwise, travel support is cancelled. This is not often followed but perhaps it should be followed. They stated that exceptions can be made for supported travelerswith a special provision or confirmation from an embassy or consulate that they will receive all visas at least one week before travel.Againeven this exception is often not adhered to as we saw at this most recent meeting when Abdeljalil did not get his visa and ICANN waited until the last weekend and Sarah Kiden was able to come. If there was2 weeks it would have been easier for all both for ICANN and for Sarah. eExceptions can be made for supported travelers with a special provision or confirmation from an embassy or consulate that they will receive all visas at least one week before travel
Also I have heard from other people that ICANN visa office is giving out wrong info. They told some travellers that they could get visa on arrival and that is simply not true for Panama and they were turned away. I know each person should be responsible for their visas but if ICANN is paying for the visa and supporting their travel than the correct info should be given and then people will not be turned away at the airport.
Visas-
Special Circumstances
ICANN Travel Support can make exceptions for special circumstances. For example, sometimes supported travelers need to travel to another country to visit a consulate or embassy to apply for or obtain a visa. In these cases, ICANN Travel Support may provide additional financial support for a single trip for that purpose.Can this issue be spelled out more? How will this be done? I recall we had an issue when Beran was on leadership and she could not attend because of these issues. There is no explanation on how this process will work? Would like to see more info on this issue
Judith Hellerstein
I think we should ask about splitting the different components 1) travel 2) hotel + per diems. If we can split them than we might want to assign some of the per diem for the travel as the guidelines state that you will cover the cost of the travel to and from the airport with the allocated per diem. If this is the be the case thansome part of the per diem should be able to be allocated to the travel and the rest to the meals.
Hotel-- I do not think supported travellers who live in the city where the meeting is happening should be allowed to use the hotel and per diem component. These should be transfered so that others can be supported. In the form for supported travellers, we have a question for flight only, hotel only. so we could give the hotel part to another traveler. Same with the per diem. Since they live in the city already they do not need per diem as they could bring food from home. The per diem is given for people who do not live in the city, state, or country.
Alan Greenberg
I disagree. Not everyone lives near a meeting site, even if "in the same city", and meetings have long days. It needs to be a personal decision. And once a person is at the meeting, bringing food from home is not a practical option.
Judith Hellerstein
Hotel---
While every effort is made to house supported travelers at the main venue hotel, nearby hotels may also be used to house supported travelers at an ICANN Public Meeting or other approved ICANN events.
In Dublin–At large was more than 1 mile away from the venue and while there were busses, it too a long time to get there. It seemed there werte closer hotels, but they were not used. Can we have some definition of what constitutes a nearby hotel?
Alan Greenberg
This is not a travel issue but one for meeting arrangements.
Glenn McKnight
As to Dubln, it was faster to walk to the location since the bus waited for ever to fill the bus. If you can't walk as in the case of Joan's broken foot she had to wait. Clearly those who have mobility issues should be situated close to the venue
Alan Greenberg
My understanding and experience is they do consider mobility issues if they are made aware of them.
Maureen Hilyard
p5 "APPROVED ICANN EVENTS" - Still not well defined. On the face of things, travel for "approved ICANN events" is simplistically directed to ICANN's founding mission and its somewhat limiting technical functions. However if ICANN were to update this focus to its Strategic VISION for 2016-2020, and its more forward thinking strategic objectives and success factors, outreach activities and events requiring travel support might be seen to be more meaningful, relevant and gainful for both ICANN and its constituency participants. But then again, that would be opening ICANN up to having to spend more on outreach than they want.
p6 " When travel support is economical and feasible" I agree with Alan that there are people who are given business class travel generally do a whole lot more work than others because of the roles they have as Chairs or Co-Chairs. Perhaps it could be indicated in the travel tables as to what that role is, so that there is more transparency about why that class of travel is provided. These are the business class allocations for San Juan [ALAC 5; ccNSO 1; GNSO 2 Business, 3 Premium Ec; NomCom 2; RSSAC 2; SSAC 2; Technical Liaison Group, all 6 Business] The Business Class Travel section on p14 says it is only for Chairs.
p6 "posts reports of nonaudited travel costs" - interesting reading - but I need to ask someone why I and my colleague Pua Hunter from the Cook Islands only account for 0.8 of a full support equivalent travel slot each. (Are we supported by another budget for the unaccounted 0.2?)
P7 in "Communications Responsibilities" #4. I assume a typo in that it should be the fourth email. I must admit that my responses are not immediate as I try to design my own itinerary that fits all the different legs that are required to get me from my island home to the meeting venue within a reasonable travel schedule and keeping costs to a minimum. Constituency Travel (CT) are usually very patient and obliging. However, problems may arise when CT itself delays approval of an itinerary so that the cost increases when they eventually make the booking and I am expected to make unsatsfactory changes to my original itinerary... not a completely happy space. Preferred travel itineraries are considered on p14.
P12 "special circumstances" - great to see that travel support is now offered if a visa is needed from another country. Does a "single trip" mean a "return single trip"?
P12 "Reimbursement for visa expenses" A maximum of USD200 does not cover the costs of getting a visa for some countries, especially when you have to apply to another country where it could (and did) cost USD150 just for the Fedex charges to transport my passport to the Indian consulate office in NZ, and not counting the additional visa fee, plus the additional costs related to documentation required beforehand. Considering that the alternative option is travelling to the other country's embassy or consulate office, the maximum cost could be increased to cover the actual costs of getting a visa. It is a big expense for some individual volunteers who have to apply for a visa to just about every meeting venue ICANN chooses.
P13 "Lowest fare at time of booking" - I discussed this earlier in the Communications section.
P13 "personal and frequent flyer preferences" - sometimes lengthy layovers in unfamiliar airports necessitate the use of a FF lounge which not only allows for work to continue to be done in reasonable comfort and with charging facilities for laptops and phones, but they also provide a zone of safety for women travelling on their own especially in countries where women may not feel completely comfortable out in the open in a public place.
P13 "ICANN arranges (lowest trip cost) travel" and can manage the security and well-being of supported travellers. How do they ensure that?? Other sections basically say that travellers have to look after themselves.
P13 "Maximum reimbursable fares". I can't see the relevance of the linked page "Methodology - standard country or area codes" to determine the maximum reimbursable amount per region. I think this is the wrong link.
Alan Greenberg
ICANN approved events are a catch-all for events that ICANN will fund travel to. Examples are IGF, CROP tribs, F2F meetings of CCWG, Review Teams, Intersessional meetings and such.
If you ask for too much specificity here, you may find we loose out later when we want them to fund something that is not in the list.
Alan Greenberg
Such travel is generally for medical or other justified reasons. I believe that ICANN is already overstepping themselves by even reporting that someone needs such extra support. As Judith says, some people no doubt abuse the situation, but ICANN has to manage this to their best ability.
I've asked.
Judith Hellerstein
For yours and Pua's travel it says 1 full time equivalent. I guess they found a mistake and fixed it. Also some of the classifications for business are for flights that were never taken. Eduardo is classified as Business but since he had no flight to Puerot Rico there was no cost. He is listed as Business since he always flys it as his own cost but is reimbursed the Max. If we are doing a proper calculation we should makes sure to X out those cases. Some people who have approval to self book often book business and then pay the difference between their cost and the Max amount assigned for their region.
Alan Greenberg
The report was corrected last night after I reported the problems.
Barring errors, those paying for their own business class and getting reimbursed for economy are listed as economy.
Judith Hellerstein
Hi Maureen, a couple of remarks. I think there needs to be a stricter policy on granting medical uses of business class as peopl are abusing the system. I know many people who get a doctor to write them a letter saying they need to travel business so ICANN can give them business, but if they are travelling on their own dime they will not pay for business. Or if other companies do not pay for business or have more difficult procedures than they take coach. On the other hand, I know people who really need business and will pay the upgrade when they cannot get it. Or alternatively they get approval to book their own travel so that they can use the moeny to book early and pay for business.
I do not understand why the Technical service group travels business when in the past none of these groups did. I am not saying anything about the SO/AC Chairs but the other groups. The USG does not allow people to travel in business but it allows for economy comfort after a certain number of hours. I think that is a good policy. If a person wants a higher class of service, they are better off getting approval to book their own traffic and then can often do better with the amount of moeny allocated to them for the travel.
APPROVED ICANN EVENTS-- CT just books travel for approved travellers so i read that as the events that were approved by the Consitituency and by their GSE.
special circumstances–My understanding of it was a return trip but good to ask for more clarifications on what it meant.
P13 "ICANN arranges (lowest trip cost) travel" and can manage the security and well-being of supported travellers. How do they ensure that?? Other sections basically say that travellers have to look after themselves.
I agree-they do not seem to manage the security and well-being of travellers on a one to one basis but if called they can work on the travellers behalf. Tehyshould add nore clarity to this sentence.
Maureen Hilyard
CT have a letter from my doctor about the maximum hours it is advised that I travel at a time.. 12 hours max..(due to a medical condition) Medical conditions are a different situation and each circumstance is different. ICANN has a policy, if CT deviates from it then CT is answerable. I don't think that we have much say there, nor about TLG.
Re ensuring well-being of supported travellers - I have experienced support from CT when I missed a flight and ICANN had to arrange another flight which they did really promptly. That additional flight must have come out of the At-Large budget (my apologies to At-Large). My point is that more clarity is needed in the sentence because not everyone feels that they receive care of their security and well-being.
Alan Greenberg
There is actually no "At-Large" travel budget. We, like other groups, get slots. The budget given to CT is based on average costs. Medical upgrades come out of yet another fund (as I have been told).
Glenn McKnight
I did a run to Singapore in economy a few years ago and despite moving around a lot I got a bladder infection and it was a painful experience ( sympathy to women). The very long trips have serious health impacts on older folks.
Judith Hellerstein
Maximum reimbursable fares---Also the link to the per diems and the max fares are not correct. It points to another document instead.
Alan Greenberg
Don't see a reference to per diem here, but the UN Stat Div link identifies how ICANN divides the world into regions for its max airfare charts.
Judith Hellerstein
ensuring the well-being of supported travellers – Yes I agree with that, but others say they felt they were stranded or had no way of contacting CT or the travel agency to make re-arrangements. I too, on the GA last year had the support of the travel agency that got me a new flight which also cost money. Anytime the travel agency handles something it generates a bill. I think this section was about security. People being in a country that is not there's and feeling stranded or not protected.
Glenn McKnight
Another way to look at the allocation of economy, premium economy and business. Its not uncommon to provide those who qualify for the higher class ticket to travel in that class when the flight is more than 7 hours to the destination. In many cases you don't have a choice since its a smaller plane and they only have economy fare
Glenn McKnight
The information provided on CT on the ICANN site regarding Per Diem and maximum fare rates tend to be quite old. I suggest they have the most up to date information for the traveller
Nadira Alaraj
The Per Diem doesn't cover the cost of economy transportation from airport to the hotel.
Alan Greenberg
It is meant to cover that. Are you saying that it is sometimes not sufficient?
Judith Hellerstein
Yes. Often the per diem is not sufficient for travel from the airport to home. Also if the travel is separated from the hotel than the person who has travel only has no per diem and must foot the bil for the cost to and from the airport.
Glenn McKnight
Its important for CT to make sure that the travel arrangements for those who have accessibility issues to located closest to the venue . This should be consistent to the registration which asks if the participant have any mobility issues
Alan Greenberg
Glenn, do you have cases where they have not done that for recent meetings? (A while ago they were rather pathetic on this.)
Judith Hellerstein
I think Glenn is possibly talking about Joan, who cannot walk too far but her accessibility issues are not taken into account.
Nadira Alaraj
1) This year CT piloted with Visa service (Newland Chase) similar to the Travel Agency (FCM).
CT offered to cover the fees for the Newland Chase (NC) visa service. This sounded as a good service, but I find out that the information provided by the host in the country where ICANN meetings is held is good enough for visa information starting process. Adding the NC pre-conditional document requirements before starting any transaction is almost same as any visa application. Hence, I decided not to use their service because this add unnecessary extra expensive cost on the allocated travel budget.
The comment here: If CT work with the host country to provide a comprehensive informative visa requirement document that would be very helpful to any traveler. The NC visa commercial service could only be used to certain countries with severe visa challenges.
2) CT to allow flexibility with ticket booking to experienced travelers under their own personal responsibilities. Also to be flexible when it comes to having a visa as a pre-conditional to do the travel booking. In both cases, cheaper tickets and shorter traveling routes could be found when booking early.
Maureen Hilyard
I agree with you, Nadira, about the Newland Chase experiment that really didn't work because we had to give a whole lot of information that we had to repeat once it was identified what as required directly with the consulate or embassy. It was a complete waste of time and at a cost that no doubt did come out of our budget.
I know that we have asked before, but I think that it is up to ICANN, as soon as they identify a venue to get all the visa information that is required for the country of the venue, that will meet the needs of all the countries that ICANN deals with. Then all this information should be put onto the ICANN website as soon as it comes to hand from the country itself.
Volunteers already spend a lot of time working for ICANN, and then they have to work in their own time (and initial expense) to get all the required documents to get to an event. Ive only done it a few times, but I feel sorry for those who have to get a visa for just about every trip they make with ICANN.
And travel insurance as well as any other expenses apart from the seat on the particular transport used, are the responsibility of the traveller.
Alan Greenberg
In my experience, countries vary greatly in how well they document their rules and how well they actually follow their rules.I know in one case, every single consulate and embassy set their own rules, and they differ greatly!
Recent rates of visa failure are actually relatively small. Of course, that does not describe the pain involved!
Judith Hellerstein
I have heard quite a number of failures and poor info given from Newland to travelers at this most recent ICANN meeting. I agree putting the info on the website is the best approach.
Judith Hellerstein
Hi Nadira, If you want to self book and get reimbursed that is an option available at the ICANN meetings but not for CROP. This way you can get the cheaper fares and worry about the visa later. However, if it does not come through you cannot get a refund on your ticket
.
Alan Greenberg
Judith, note that self booking implies you may not get repaid until several months after the meeting. Not everyone has that level of fiscal flexibility and available funds.
Judith Hellerstein
Hi Alan, 90% of the time I receive my reimbursement in less than 1 month from the end of the ICANN meeting. In only 1-2 times has it ever taken more than 1 month after the icann meeting. The longer waiting time is before the meeting begins
Nadira Alaraj
Why travel insurance cost is not part of ICANN travel costs? Many Visa requirements like Schengen countries ask for travel insurance but many ICANN travelers they don't have any travel insurance plans, ICANN fellows are asked to their travel insurance on their own expenses.
Alan Greenberg
On page 12, it says that required travel insurance is reimbursable. Don't know if this is a current rule or just part of the new guidelines.
Judith Hellerstein
I thought it was only reimbursable when it iwas required to get a visa but otherwise it is not reimbursable
Cheryl Langdon-Orr
I think the comment is in good shape.
Javier Rúa-Jovet
Marita Moll
The insurance issue needs clarification. Volunteers are traveling on ICANN $$ to do ICANN business. Is there not a legal duty for ICANN to provide insurance in such cases? If not, it should be made very clear that people are traveling for ICANN at their own risk.
Alan Greenberg
It says "ICANN will reimburse travel insurance expenses only if required to apply for visa. To be reimbursed, the supported traveler must provide proof that the insurance is required."
I am not sure how it can be made clearer.
I have no idea whether ICANN provides insurance for employees or contractors, but we are neither of those and travel as volunteers.
Marita Moll
Unfortunately, many new people don't think about it or make false assumptions. I would make it clearer by starting the section with a statement like "ICANN does not offer travel insurance or pay for travel insurance for volunteers."
In the case of employees, ICANN would have to pay for travel insurance or be open to legal action in case of accidents. For contractors, probably not the case.
We live in a world where there is a warning on everything – even plastic bags.
Alan Greenberg
Noted.
Judith Hellerstein
A good draft but a few things to clarify
Approved ICANN Events should be clarified. A better description would be to add or substitute this phrase: "These are meetings where ICANN is funding the attendance of the participant" . The guidelines currently state--
Travel by the Numbers, Page 10, on the split of numbers. If there is a split of 4, 4, &2 than I would ask that we should be able to combine two flights slots into one full slot. Since they are valued equally there should not be any reason why they should not be combined.
Also I think an amount should be set aside for travel to and from the airport and added to the flight component and taken out of the per diem.
Wire Transfer Fees: I have seen some Orgs reimburses fees over $25. So that is a possibility.
Shared Funding: I think we should separate out transfer to/from airport from per diem and atttach them to the flight component, perhaps in these miscellaneous fees.
Cancellations and Substitutions--"Up to 45 days before the start of an event, a community group or program may substitute another supported traveler under either of these circumstances".
I think this needs to be clarified as we often substitute people a few days before the event. Will this limit our ability to substitute people? Are we comfortable with this being listed here? I think we need a cut off date of 1 week prior to receipt of a visa. I think the 2 days we had this time when Abdeljalil could not get his visa was too short a time.
Recovery of fees: I think that there should also be a way to recover Per diems sent out to a traveler who has cancelled. I noticed when reviewing the Travel report that Per diems were paid to people who had cancelled. Is there a process for people who cancelled or dropped out to return the perdiems they had already received. If so, what is that process? I think this should be clarified.
Visas: Great ideas. I also noticed on the travel report that visas often cost more than 200 and that ICANN has paid more so perhaps they may want to raise the reimbursement amount to cover actual costs.
Self-Arranged Travel, Page 13: Great Idea to have a standing order of acceptance for self-booked travellers. I often have to send multiple messages to get approval. I am told that for CROP there are no established max fares and that is why they make you use the ICANN Travel Dept.
Having used this for most of my travels. I do not see the problems you had identified. ICANN publishes a max amount per region and travelers can spend whatever they want on a ticket, but ICANN will only reimburse up to the published Maximum amounts. Tickets can be purchased in any class of service. What I would state is that regardless of the class of service purchased, if the supported traveller is only supported for economy class, than that is what should be listed. It should not be listed that they travelled in Business Class, yes they might have but ICANN did not pay for this. They paid only for economy. This gives the wrong impression, e.g., Eduardo pays for business out of his pocket, ICANN only pays economy, but he is listed as travelling Business and this gives the wrong impression.
Preferred Travel Itinerary: Since ICANN is not paying for airport transfer fees, Participants should not be penalized by wanting to take flights leaving on their preferred carrier from a preferred airport. Preferred airports in a city have flights that maybe more expensive, but the costs in time and in money to reach these airports are often less expensive as such a true comparison cannot be made. Insisting that participants take the cheapest flight puts more burdens on the participants. For example flights from DCA are often more expensive than IAD, but it is much easier to get to DCA and more cost efficient than to get to IAD.
Train Travel: We should ask that a reserved reservation which guarantees a seat be incluuded in the price
Alan Greenberg
These definitions are preceded by "The following terms are used in these guidelines" and the guidelines are for Communiity Travel Support. So that is implied.
It already asks that: "Or since they are both 0.4, we can provide two Airs and one Per Diem with a slot?"
Travel costs vary widely. For me, it is $0 if my wife drives me or $40 if I have to take a taxi. For others, it may approach $150. So it has to be done on a case-by-case basis.
That is a matter for discussion on a case by case basis as already happens. We try to not disenfranchise travelers if we can avoid it, as in many cases, visas are not under their control.
I am quite sure that ICANN either attempts to recover such payments, or applies them to the next trip if applicable.
These new guidelines have an explicit process for this now. If this stays in the document post-draft, you can cite that section if they tell you this next time.
For other approved ICANN events, the designated Travel Management Company derives the maximum reimbursable amount based on an economy fare (nonrefundable ticket), approved date of arrival and departure, most direct or nonstop flight, and lowest logical fare available at time of booking in that order.
You are correct about how it has worked, but that is not what the new guidelines say and I was pointing that out. It says the FARE must be under the maximum, and it should be the reimbursable amount.
Good point. I will add that, although it is not likely something they will accept.
Judith Hellerstein
HI
I just added this line about train travel-Train Travel: We should ask that a reserved reservation which guarantees a seat be incluuded in the priceAlan Greenberg
I effectively did say just that since first class travel is often the only way to get a reserved seat. But I will make it clearer.
Judith Hellerstein
Actually for Amtrak, all trains are reserved trains. They only sell tickets for the exact number of seats they have. Many years ago that was not the case. I know in Europe the trains have assigned seats in the economy class. So when you buy a ticket it is for an exact seat.
Judith Hellerstein
Crop-I was told by CT that there is no max price set for crop trips that are not connected to an ICANN Meeting. It is based on what the Travel Agency finds. You can ask for a different flight if there is about 40 USD difference and they will often will grant that.
Joan Katambi
one comment;
About the travel insurance on page 9 can ICANN provide more clarity on which groups of people receive the Insurance reimbursement, are ICANN fellows and Next generation participants considered?
Glenn McKnight
Hi Joan
My wife and I purchase in Canada yearly coverage for unlimited travel. The cautionary note is you have to be healthy and disclose your health condition. Its much cheaper than a limited 5 or so days of travel( many vendors sale a daily rate) As an example unlimted travel health insurance for myself ( 64 yrs old) maximum 9 days per trip is $100 . An individual rate for one trip of 8 days only is $48 . As you can see an annual plan is cheaper. Depending on the ICANN event the number of days will vary and subsequently the rate will vary. I strongly recommend getting insurance yourself and check what is covered. Don't count on ICANN
Joan Katambi
Thanks Glenn
Alan Greenberg
It says that ICANN will reimburse travel insurance costs that are required to obtain a visa. It does not restrict this to a particular class of travelers.
Joan Katambi
Noted
Judith Hellerstein
Notification of per diems.–Actually ICANN does notify you when the accounts payable is sending money to your account but there is no breakdown of what the money is for. it would be helpful if ICANN included a breakdown of what the transfer includes. Something like--Flight, Per diems at XUSD a day for x days, visas at Xusd.
Alan Greenberg
Perhaps they just pick on me. I have received such message a small handful of times over 12 years and the last one was in 2016.
Sarah Kiden
Judith Hellerstein I remember at the Copenhagen meeting I received a visa refund and per diem. I didn't know the details but requested Joseph to send a breakdown so that I can know. These days I receive a breakdown for all remittances. They should probably do this for everyone.
Krishna Seeburn
I think each have properly touched the varied areas of importance.
VISAs & Travel slots are very much intertwined together. I think the issue could be solved ahead of time before slots are allotted well ahead of time. The way i see it, is that whoever needs to travel needs to clear VISAs ahead with the ICANN travel so that a well prepared work is done ahead so that if the person does not get cleared to travel the next inline could be looking at the slot so that someone else can be properly prepared to followup. The issue is time and communications that needs to have a proper flow. This can only be achieved if we can ensure a flow is set so that in case things don't work out the allocation can be done on a priority list. But yes we have to ensure from start that those travelling are properly cleared before the next allocation.
Alan Greenberg
That is basically what we do. Sometimes it works better than others...
Nadira Alaraj
Shreedeep Rayamajhi
I think there is a greater issue of VISA when it comes to people coming from developing nation as we have to go through a rigorous process and for certain reason the time varies and prolongs. For developed nation it may be a stipulated time but for people coming in from developing nation VISA can be a major challenge. There needs to be some consideration for people coming in from developing nation as its a tough job travelling and still not getting the visa or being pressured of being within the time frame.