Zoom Chat: 2021-12-13 NARALO Teleconference

11:57:20 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Welcome all to the NARALO Monthly cal
11:58:30 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
https://thewebaround.com/
11:59:22 From James Galvin (RySG) to Everyone:
Thx Jonathan! Found it just as you published it.
11:59:57 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
I THINK it’s a long A, in Palage
12:00:06 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
The second A
12:00:44 From Heidi Ullrich to Everyone:
Welcome, All.
12:01:37 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Welcome Marita Moll to the call
12:02:03 From Marita Moll to Everyone:
Pleased to be here
12:02:20 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
am happy to be here
12:02:54 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
We can hold it at the Hollywood Bowl where there’s plenty of outdoor space!
12:03:03 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
https://docs.google.com/forms/d/e/1FAIpQLSfJpnyYFo8B-0tgipn_2pnYzT8AEtjGUmIPafFsXUO-c4y38w/viewform?pli=1
12:03:37 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Welcome Michael Palage
12:04:10 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Link to form: https://forms.gle/oGK4PdaXzAECeoc68
12:05:02 From Heidi Ullrich to Everyone:
@All, kind reminder that the FY23 Additional Budget Request process is now open. Please see the workspace: https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/At-Large+FY23+Budget+Development+Workspace
12:05:26 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Please contact Ed or myself if you need help in any submission
12:16:10 From Naela Sarras to Everyone:
Hello all.
12:17:12 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Welcome Jeff Neuman
12:17:20 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Hello
12:17:27 From maureen hilyard to Everyone:
Its a very comfortable 9am for me in NZ at the moment. Happy to join another of your great policy sessions.
12:17:31 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Greetings Jeff
12:17:38 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Yahoo?
12:17:49 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
We are looking for speakers in future NARALO calls. please reach out to us
12:18:01 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
McKnight.glenn@gmail.com
12:18:02 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
CORE
12:18:07 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
France Telecom
12:18:09 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Register.com
12:18:19 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
AOL and MelbourneIT
12:18:25 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
https://forms.gle/oGK4PdaXzAECeoc68
12:19:10 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
ICANN Glossary
12:20:16 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
https://www.icann.org/resources/en/glossary
12:21:18 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
ATLARGE and Transfer Policy https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/At-Large+Workspace+for+the+Transfer+Policy+Review+PDP ALAC Members: Steinar Grøtterød and Daniel Nanghaka ALAC Alternates: Raymond Mamattah and Lutz Donnerhacke ALAC Observers: Chokri Ben Romdhane, Hans Bathija, K Mohan Raidu, Sivasubramanian Muthusamy
12:21:26 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Originally called XRP :)
12:21:45 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Everything is EPDP
12:21:46 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Brief History On December 1, 2016, ICANN enforced a new transfer policy that changes the process of changing domain ownership from one registrant to another and modifying how a registrant updates their domain's account and contact information
12:22:14 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Q and A https://www.hostpapa.ca/knowledgebase/icanns-new-transfer-policy-faq/
12:22:40 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Currently the Transfer Policy WG consists of List of membership 31 Registrar Stakeholder Group 3 ATlarge and 1 BC https://community.icann.org/display/TPRPDP/Alternate+Log+-+Transfer+Policy+Review+PDP
12:23:10 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Thanks for that timeline Glenn - funny that I worked on the 2013 RAA updates and the 2016 Transfer policy updates, but they got conflated in my memory!
12:23:10 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
Perhaps focus in on the End User perspective?
12:23:36 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Although Verisign did not implement EPP for a number of years after EPP was created, they were one of the authors of that protocol (Scott Hollenback).
12:24:08 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Transfer Lock was a GoDaddy creation if I remember correctly
12:24:39 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
oh, right
12:26:12 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
And ensuring a Registrar got paid was (and still is) an ICANN requirement that was originally derived from the White Paper.
12:26:44 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Welcome Peter Knight
12:27:26 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Welcome Dr. Knight
12:28:04 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
The original Transfer Review (2002 or 2003) was really pushed by Tucows at the time because Network Solutions was Nacking most of the transfer requests
12:28:15 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Before
12:28:17 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
After 2006
12:28:25 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
oh - before 2016
12:29:00 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
I was in that Transfer PDP and did not want the FOAs for registries that implemented EPP
12:29:08 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Jeff did you want to add a comment?
12:29:23 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Jeff you will be next
12:29:56 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
Excellent Point Sarah
12:30:21 From Peter Knight to Everyone:
:-)
12:30:49 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Jonathan did you want to jump in with a comment?
12:33:37 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
No thanks. I have a question but I think it makes sense for the speakers to speak first
12:33:46 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
ok
12:34:32 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
The At-Large Community, not the ALAC
12:34:48 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Naralo member
12:35:10 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
The acronyms kill even the best of us
12:36:07 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Yes I am a Naralo member and a member of the At-Large
12:36:20 From David Mackey to Everyone:
We have an amazing level of experience here today. Thanks for everyone joining today.
12:36:21 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Thanks Jeff
12:36:52 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Folks post your questions so we can have your imput to facilitate this session
12:38:25 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
I like to call out Marita and Jonathan if you have any comments on ALAC position on the transfer policy
12:40:23 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Daniel I want Sarah to clarify the Registrar role and I will turn to you
12:40:42 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
alright
12:44:39 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Auth Codes have been used for a number of purposes though, such as credentialing. Will they still be able to be used for such purposes?
12:45:08 From David Mackey to Everyone:
Does anyone know how many domain names are transferred each year … approximately?
12:45:09 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
What if it is just a typo?
12:46:04 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
Ok....if there is a threshold.
12:46:52 From Jeff Neuman to Everyone:
I can tell you that Auth Codes are used by Registries that authenticate its users. So there is use beyond just transfers
12:47:56 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
So the number of transfers can be viewed in the monthly registry reports, here is the latest copy of the .COM registry - https://www.icann.org/sites/default/files/mrr/com/com-transactions-202108-en.csv
12:48:16 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Thanks Michael
12:48:48 From David Mackey to Everyone:
ty Michael
12:48:50 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
So can the number be calculated yes, but there is a lot of computations to undertake, perhaps ICANN may have easier aggregated numbers to share
12:49:12 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Jeff - the WG has a note about the fact that the TAC is sometimes used for other purposes, but no recommendations allowing or prohibiting that (that I can find). The definition of TAC will very specific that it's used to determine the validity/approval of a transfer, but I'm not sure we can effectively disallow anyone from using the same code for another purpose
12:49:53 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Also, because the TAC is not created at the time of registration (only created when it's needed) I'm not sure how it could be useful outside of the transfer process
12:50:04 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
The end user aim is to make sure that the domain is transfered in a secure manner
12:50:21 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Yes Daniel I think this is the intention
12:50:22 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
The data starts in Column V, interesting enough it also tracks unsuccessful transfers, nacks, and disputes,
12:50:30 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
TAC is a strong element in the transfer process
12:50:40 From James Galvin (RySG) to Everyone:
Using it for other purposes would be “bad” in the model being developed. If there really are other uses we need to catalog those and consider what it means. It’s important to note that if an authInfo exists, then a transfer is valid as far as a registry is concerned, irrespective of other uses.
12:50:49 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
It has been a loooooooong time since reviewing all these data elements
12:50:56 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Sarah I see your hand
12:51:23 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Then I will turn to James since he will be leaving for another meeting
12:52:04 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
JZ - the 60 day lock is one of the elements for deliberation in the TPR
12:52:57 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
I guess thee are those in the At-Large community is a desire for a confirmation, rather than just a notification.
12:53:43 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
@Sarah, that is one of the deliberations that we have to do in the TPR
12:53:45 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Jonathan - would you say providing the TAC to the gaining registrar is not a confirmation of intent to transfer?
12:54:11 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
@Jonathan - I think that is fair point and I was thinking of Milton's IGF session last week about Digital Self Determination
12:54:50 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
Just receiving notification undercuts that Digital Self Determination
12:55:04 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
Well, not in case of account breach. You’re already talking about a notification from the losing registrar but that can easily be lost (in spam, etc.) and it seems as though an affirmative confirmation would be better, if unnecessary most of the time.
12:55:27 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
Sorry, Mike, was responding to Sarah
12:55:45 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Jonathan, that makes sense, thanks!
12:56:12 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
How about the Current Registrant - Authorizing the TAC, they are in the loop and can exercise Digital Self Determination
12:56:54 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
We totally get the inability of the GAINING register to contact the losing registrant b/c of GDPR
12:57:56 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
When does the Transfer WG meet?
12:58:10 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Michael, interesting idea. How would that (authorizing the TAC) look different than requesting the TAC?
12:58:15 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Tuesdays
12:58:24 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
it meets every Tuesday
12:58:43 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
https://community.icann.org/display/TPRPDP/Transfer+Policy+Review+PDP
12:59:17 From David Mackey to Everyone:
ty Sarah
12:59:26 From maureen hilyard to Everyone:
Thank you for being a part of this discussion, James. Congratulations again for your appointment to the ICANN Board.
12:59:31 From James Galvin (RySG) to Everyone:
bye all. thanks for the excellent discussion!
13:00:29 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Dr. Milton Mueller is with Parminder on the IGF restructure
13:00:57 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
see the ATLARGE discussion in contrast to Wolfgangs' postion
13:02:48 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
But to clarify, Michael was agreeing with ME
13:04:05 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Note
13:04:06 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Currently the Transfer Policy WG consists of List of membership 31 Registrar Stakeholder Group 3 ATlarge and 1 BC
13:04:36 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
List of active and inactive members from ICANN website
13:05:10 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
To clarify, there are up to 10 Registrar members, not 31
13:05:38 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
https://community.icann.org/display/TPRPDP/5.+PDP+Members+and+mailing+list
13:06:01 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
ICANN fee reductions, that would exceed
13:06:09 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
31 participants
13:06:16 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
https://community.icann.org/display/TPRPDP/Alternate+Log+-+Transfer+Policy+Review+PDP
13:07:16 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Jon I will turn to you after sarah
13:08:37 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
yes, exactly! thank you for taking my thought where it needed to end up :)
13:09:17 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
So this all goes back to that balance between security and ease of use, which is kind of the fundamental problem of the Internet itself, right? :)
13:09:19 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
The most important thing is how secure is the domain transfer
13:09:22 From Eduardo Diaz to Everyone:
Thanks for the answers about the end users.
13:10:14 From maureen hilyard to Everyone:
Thanks Glenn. This is a learning session for me. The transfer policy has always been a bit of a mystery for me.
13:10:26 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
I can be reached any time at sarah@tucows.com :)
13:10:39 From David Mackey to Everyone:
Eduardo, we know the truth!
13:10:49 From Naela Sarras to Everyone:
Eduardo I don’t believe that 
13:11:01 From Bill Jouris to Everyone:
As opposed to Glenn wanting to talk about hockey
13:11:04 From Marita Moll to Everyone:
Ditto @ Maureen. Less of a mystery now
13:11:32 From David Mackey to Everyone:
@Bill, there’s nothing wrong talking about hockey as long as it’s not talking about the Leafs
13:11:55 From Silvia Vivanco to Everyone:
@ all please kindly complete the survey which will be displayed after this call
13:12:10 From Bill Jouris to Everyone:
@David, you mean "as long as it's not talking *positively* about the Leafs"
13:12:37 From David Mackey to Everyone:
@Bill LOL, yes, thanks for the clarification
13:12:43 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Hey, no trash talking the Leafs while I'm around, please
13:12:49 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
they almost won the Stanley cup one time!
13:13:09 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
I remember when the leafs won in 1966 or 67
13:13:10 From David Mackey to Everyone:
@Sarah, sorry eh, lol
13:13:16 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
thanks eh
13:13:23 From maureen hilyard to Everyone:
@Marita. I try to make all the NARALO sessions as I find them a great learning opportunity because the important explanations by your specifically chosen speakers are in simple non-technical English
13:13:42 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
Thank you
13:14:00 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
Need to run - great session
13:14:03 From Heidi Ullrich to Everyone:
Many thanks for the extremely informative session.
13:14:07 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
Thanks again for the invite
13:14:11 From Heidi Ullrich to Everyone:
Excellent moderation, Glenn!
13:14:13 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
Thanks all for coming all the best
13:14:16 From David Mackey to Everyone:
+1 Heidi
13:14:27 From Heidi Ullrich to Everyone:
Happy Holidays.
13:14:32 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
Thank you all
13:14:36 From Daniel Nanghaka to Everyone:
bye
13:14:37 From David Mackey to Everyone:
Bye All
13:14:39 From Silvia Vivanco to Everyone:
Happy Holidays to all!
13:14:49 From Silvia Vivanco to Everyone:
Thank you so very much for your participation this year!
13:14:56 From Naela Sarras to Everyone:
Thanks all. Happy end of year to all
13:15:12 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
Whoo hoo
13:15:17 From maureen hilyard to Everyone:
Sounds great!
13:15:26 From Claudia Ruiz - ICANN Org to Everyone:
https://community.icann.org/x/24nOCg
13:15:29 From Naela Sarras to Everyone:
YES the Universal Acceptance training. Please help pformote
13:15:33 From Sarah Wyld (RrSG/Tucows) to Everyone:
Thanks, all!
13:24:47 From Glenn McKnight to Everyone:
changed background for ZOOM
13:25:03 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
Much better, Glen!