Members:  Stephen Deerhake, Teddy Purwadi , Patricio Poblete, Nigel Roberts, Svitlana Tkachenko, Peter Koch, Nick Wenban Smith, Nenad Orlic, Sean Copeland, Allan MacGillivrey


Observers and experts:  Kim Davies, Naela Sarras, Jaap Akkerhuis

Staff:  Bart Boswinkel, Bernie Turcotte, Kim Carlson

Apologies:  Peter Van Roste, Peter Vergote, Eberhard Lisse, Kristina Hakobyan, Barrack Otieno

Agenda: agenda.2019-02-14.pdf


Recordings:  Zoom

Transcript:  EN

Chat Transcript:

15:40:39 From Kimberly Carlson : Hello, welcome
15:43:21 From ppoblete : yes
15:46:41 From teddyap : Hi:-)
15:48:27 From Kimberly Carlson : hello all, please let me know if you need any assistance with connecting your audio or navigating Zoom
15:51:55 From sveta : hello!
15:52:11 From Joke Braeken : hello everyone. Should you wish to follow the live note taking today, go to This Google document is also shared via zoom.
15:57:05 From Nenad Orlić : I would need help with audio
15:57:22 From Bernard : hello all
15:58:27 From Allan MacGillivray : No pressure, but you people are all that stand between me and my wife's St. Valentine's dinner. No pressure.
15:58:46 From Joke Braeken : Thanks :) midnight indeed here.
15:58:49 From Kimberly Carlson : yes, thanks all for being here
15:59:11 From nickw : I've cooked valentines dinner :)
15:59:19 From Kimberly Carlson : Happy Valentine's Day
16:00:03 From Kimberly Carlson : Happy birthday!!!!
16:00:06 From Joke Braeken : happy birthday Stephen!
16:00:32 From Allan MacGillivray : Is your birthday on St. Valentines every year :)
16:01:00 From Nenad Orlić : managed to get audio through application
16:01:14 From Nenad Orlić : it doesn't work through browser
16:01:58 From teddyap : happy birthday Stephen
16:02:07 From Kimberly Carlson : Welcome to today’s ccPDP on retirement on 14 February at 23:00 UTC. We have apologies: Peter Van Roste, Peter Vergote, Eberhard Lisse, Kristina Hakobyan
16:02:10 From ppoblete : Happy birthday Stephen
16:03:15 From Peter Koch : applause for zoom!
16:03:28 From Joke Braeken : Should you wish to follow the live note taking today, go to This Google document is also shared via zoom.
16:03:35 From Nenad Orlić : audio is not that great currently
16:03:58 From nickw : I have to say I do like Zoom
16:07:54 From Kim Davies : 15:15 18:30 Saturday
16:08:30 From Kim Davies : Room 403
16:08:37 From nickw : perfect thank you
16:08:38 From Kimberly Carlson : 403 (KICC) unconfirmed
16:08:44 From Kimberly Carlson : break is optional
16:11:00 From Allan MacGillivray : I thoght that the timing of the Kobe meeting was made known at our last meeting.
16:11:48 From Joke Braeken : Kim has sent an email to the ccNSO members mailing list and the ccTLD community mailing list on 12 December, to inform everyone of the high-level schedule of the ccNSO sessions in Kobe
16:12:08 From Joke Braeken : that schedule was also included in the December and January editions of the ccNSO newsletter
16:13:20 From nickw : ok my bad, it's difficult for the unitiated to follow what the official schedule might be :)
16:15:00 From Kim Davies : It is a privacy block because there is something else in the foreground
16:15:59 From jaap : The blob disappeared when I went to full screen mode
16:16:17 From Joke Braeken : should wish to subscribe to the ccNSO newsletter, go to
16:17:58 From Kimberly Carlson : the blob was the zoom menu bar on my screen, i removed it. apologies
16:18:32 From jaap : Apologies accepted :-)
16:18:40 From Peter Koch : same question Nick just asked
16:19:03 From teddyap : everyone, this is my first chat with you.
16:19:59 From Nenad Orlić : Armenia is retiring its IDN ccTLD domain as far as i know
16:20:28 From Nenad Orlić : Is .հայ ccTLD manager in ccNSO?
16:20:49 From Kim Davies : If a ccTLD manager is voluntarily turning down a ccTLD, it is out of scope for this policy
16:21:33 From Peter Koch : at least a footnote would be due that points out there are uncertainties
16:21:49 From Allan MacGillivray : Peter +1
16:22:05 From teddyap : have the following issues been discussed? IMHO: We know that using ccTLD already has other uses, like gTLD 2-chars. Do we need to revise RFC1591?
16:23:00 From Nenad Orlić : If (North) Macedonia changes its ISO 3166 codes, what happens to .мкд
16:24:36 From Kim Davies : If the alpha-2 code changes, it has no material impact on an IDN ccTLD, however if the country name changes and it is no longer a meaningful string to represent the country name, it may run afoul of Fast Track requirements.
16:25:25 From Nenad Orlić : In case of (North) Macedonia it is more likely that alpha-3 will change
16:25:47 From Nenad Orlić : Not sure how that works :)
16:26:24 From Peter Koch : alpha-3 should be irrelevant; IDN string needs to be ‘related’ to an alpha-2 code, not necessarily ‘reflect’ it
16:27:53 From Nenad Orlić : since ISO-3166 is ASCII it does not cover IDN domains at all if you want to read it very narrowly
16:28:07 From Nenad Orlić : if you do not want to, .мкд is alpha-3 code
16:28:12 From Sean Copeland : I agree with your comment Bernard on defining it to the active ccnso community, unlike Stephen’s comment at the start I don’t think one could just leave the ccNSO, it comes across as transferring assets to my wife in an emergency.
16:28:15 From Kim Davies : IDN domains are directly predicated on the existence of the country in ISO 3166-1
16:30:05 From Peter Koch : yes, Kim, the _existence_
16:32:08 From nickw : Yes I agree with Nenad, more than 30 days would be sensible
16:32:47 From Kim Davies : Isn’t that an operational procedure, not a policy?
16:32:52 From Sean Copeland : Understanding the TLD manager is a role, should the IANA database be updated to the person in the agreement?
16:33:03 From Sean Copeland : upon execution?
16:33:32 From teddyap : My opinon doesn't matter if ccTLD is used like a gTLD by RAR (Registrant) telelvision media, like .tv. But do we need to chnage RFC1591?
16:40:50 From teddyap : ~that ccTLD can be used for the meaning of other names outisde the ccTLD represnting the name of a country
16:44:11 From alyssa.moore : I recall someone in Barcelona saying there is no limit to the term they will accept a registration for. Even if there are terms beyond ten years, I don't think the retirement period should extend beyond that.
16:46:00 From Bernard : @AM - fair enough
16:46:05 From alyssa.moore : Agree we should justify this, though.
16:51:19 From Peter Koch : On a more general note, we should replace “PTI” by “IANA” or “the IANA Functions Operator (IFO)”
16:52:27 From Kim Davies : Peter: IFO refers to ICANN, not PTI’s role… my preference is to define IANA formally at the first instance and then just use IANA beyond that
16:53:12 From Peter Koch : @Kim, ACK
16:53:52 From Nenad Orlić : I volunteer to explain that to general public when the time comes :)
16:54:14 From Kim Davies : Agree with Nick
16:56:11 From Peter Koch : I would like to suggest we discuss this section in Kobe; giving PTI/IANA the responsibility to assess the ‘threat to the security and stability’ of the DNS appears sub optimal to me
16:59:47 From Allan MacGillivray : I agree with Peter. We should discuss 4.3 in Kobe.
17:00:52 From teddyap : ~and, reffering to my email, [apologies repetion] "We suggest that ccTLD Manager as a job title of an organization, not a person name. By doing this, when there is a routing raotation in the organization, there is no nedd to contact IANA/PTI for name changes as the job title and other details will remain the same.
17:02:16 From ppoblete : “ccTLD manager” refers to the organization, not to a person
17:02:34 From Peter Koch : list is fine, but f2f gave us other means of interaction
17:04:38 From Kim Davies : While its slightly off topic, I want to caution against considering that IANA/PTI should not be informed of name changes of personnel that perform certain roles. It is actually operationally important we know the identity of individuals (even if it is not published in the WHOIS) in order to establish trust in the event we cannot otherwise (lost credentials, emergency response, etc.)
17:04:53 From Kim Davies : (That is for teddyap)
17:05:00 From Nenad Orlić : OK
17:05:25 From teddyap : Thanks, Kim
17:09:30 From Allan MacGillivray : And, when is the next meeting?
17:10:07 From teddyap : 28-Feb-2019?
17:10:39 From Nenad Orlić : Am I really only one thinking that IDN ccTLDs should be included in this policy in some way?
17:10:40 From Kimberly Carlson : Yes, 28th at 05:00 UTC
17:10:46 From Joke Braeken : indeed. 28 Febr 2019. Will check regarding the exact time
17:11:03 From teddyap : Thank You
17:11:26 From Bernard : thanks all
17:11:31 From alyssa.moore : you've all been wonderful valentines! heheh
17:11:31 From Joke Braeken : Thank you all. Bye
17:11:32 From Kimberly Carlson : thank you everyone, appreciate your patience
17:11:34 From Kimberly Carlson : bye
17:11:34 From Nenad Orlić : bye all
17:11:38 From nickw : thanks and good night
17:11:41 From Sean Copeland : Thank you and good evening
17:11:42 From ppoblete : bye everyone
17:11:44 From teddyap : bye all:-)
17:11:50 From jaap : bye all

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