Attendees:

Sub-group Members: Cheryl Langdon-Orr, Christopher Wilkinson, Greg Shatan, Jorge Villa, Julf Helsingius, Kavouss Arasteh (audio only), Seun Ojedeji, Steve DelBianco, Tom Dale. (8)

Observers/Guests: Taylor RW Bentley

Staff: Karen Mulberry, Larisa Gurnick, Lars Hoffman, Nathalie Vergnolle,Tristana Webster, Yvette Guigneaux

Apologies: Alan Greenberg, Farzaneh Badii, Sebastien Bachollet

** If your name is missing from attendance or apology, please send note to acct-staff@icann.org **

Transcript

Recording

Agenda

0. Call Administration (2- 5 min CLO)

1. Review of any AI's from call #13 on December 1st see https://community.icann.org/x/XoTDAw[community.icann.org] (5 min CLO)

2. Updates (5-10 mins) :-
* Expected input from the Survey sent to SO and AC's (5 min CLO)
* Any Sub Team Activities since our last call (3-5 min SDB)

3. Discussion
* Next Steps
- draft recommendation on IRP and its applicability (5-10 min SDB)

- first draft of recommendation of WS2 on MAR . (5-10 min SDB/CLO)

- Review our 2017 activities and timeline (10 min CLO/SDB)

4. Next Meeting and future Meeting schedule (2 Min CLO/Staff)

5. AOB and recap of any AI's (3-5 min CLO)

Notes (including relevant portions of the chat):

WS2 SO/AC Acct Subgroup Mtg #14 | 08 December 2016 @ 19:00 UTC

0. Call Administration

· Audio Only: Kavouss Arasteh
· Apologies: Farzaneh Badii
· No SOI updates

1. Review of any AI's from call #13 on December 1st

· see https://community.icann.org/x/XoTDAw
· Action items from call #13 will be discussed in the updates portion of this call.

2. Updates:

- Expected input from the Survey sent to SO and AC's

· we are receiving responses
· 1 request for extension of time
· We should have enough material to proceed
· Thanks to all who have helped with this

- Any Sub Team Activities since our last call

· updated draft document with inputs received

3. Discussion - Next Steps

- draft recommendation on IRP and its applicability

· page 5 - track3 was updated. Asking the group to validate if the group is comfortable with this draft
· low turn-out today, the question will be put to the mailing list.
· Steve read thru the edits made.
· a few typos to be cleaned up.
· ought to add a conclusion line "therefore concludes that an IRP would not be applicable".
Christopher Wilkinson is very satisfied with the outcome of the group on this topic.

ACTION (Steve): send the extract edited section on IRP to the mailing list for review

- first draft of recommendation of WS2 on MAR

waiting for inputs, to start forming out opinions on this topic.
· approach will be the same as for the IRP, ie collect inputs on Google Doc, to be brought for discussion.
· some useful suggestions in last week's call should be added to the doc.
· Steve indicated that a preliminary conclusion was noted at the bottom of page 4, and feedback is expected from the group on this paragraph.
Steve read thru the preliminary conclusion.
Due to low turn out, additional inputs need to be sought through the mailing list.
Greg: we should check with Goran and with SO/AC if they do meet.
Steve proposes a revised sentence:"SO/AC chairs have a standing email list and may convene calls and meetings at any time. That creates an appropriate and adequate forum for sharing of experiences and best practices on accountability to their respective stakeholders."
Cheryl indicated she was also uncomfortable with that part of the text, and suggests to submit the revised sentence to the list. Wonder what the empowered community may want to do on that.
· Steve recommends to not include the empowered community in the report, as it does not represent all SO/ACs.
· Cheryl clarified that she did not mean to include the empowered community here, just wondering what it may do in the future.
· Steve prefers that the entire report be sent to the list. The full report will be sent, and the 2 sections that require feedback on will be highlighted.
· Steve DelBianco: one of our group is showing as "Anonymous" when editing the Google Doc. Would prefer that individual identify themselves.
· Greg: have we accepted the idea of mutual accountability? it seems premature to approach this this way.
· Steve/Greg discussion can be looked up in the chat.
· Cheryl encouraged Greg to indicate his point in the Google doc.

ACTION(Steve): seek inputs from the mailing list on MAR

- Review our 2017 activities and timeline

· We should have the beginning of our data capture exercise before the end of this calendar year.
· We'll continue to update our draft report, with a special focus on MAR.
· We should have completed page 5 (on IRP) by the end of the year.
· Beginning of 2017, we should be able to start discussing SO/AC processes for accountability.
We'll need to clarify timeline and specific dates for public review period with staff.

4. Next Meeting and future Meeting schedule

· Meeting #15 Thursday, Dec 15th, 0500 UTC will be the last meeting of this calendar year
· Next meeting after that will be on 12 January 17.
· We'll decide in our next meeting what we should accomplish during that long break between our next 2 calls.

5. AOB and recap of any AI’s

· No AOB

Action Items

ACTION (Steve): send the extract edited section on IRP to the mailing list for review

ACTION(Steve): seek inputs from the mailing list on MAR

Documents Presented

SOACAccountabilityReportDraftv1.docx.pdf

Chat Transcript

Yvette Guigneaux: Welcome all to the WS2 SO/AC Subgroup Mtg #14 | 08 December 2016 @ 19: 00 UTC!

Steve DelBianco [BC]: Our latest draft report is at https: //urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__docs.google.com_document_d_14XrP2QiGv04qNtn-5FEuOR3nEc6uAN2ySlpQM5f69PNI8_edit&d=DgICaQ&c=FmY1u3PJp6wrcrwll3mSVzgfkbPSS6sJms7xcl4I5cM&r=xjNMRR-fjlgBx7tqUEv8lZv2O9RJyMyqWkymcecegCUuwDxFVsW6VBuvkqKnS_lk&m=A0dDJiDm4wpFD4RfjrY6I4RfXkBikULBr7M1yHos4o8&s=rWW6k2Rj7f6b35s4Os_XpVRgaAg5732iKp0MXvgOAyU&e=

Yvette Guigneaux: got it Steve, thank you

Julf Helsingius: I am in a somewhat noisy environment, so will try to avoid using microphone - preferably using chat instead

Yvette Guigneaux: Kavouss is only on audio - noted

Yvette Guigneaux: copy that Julf

Steve DelBianco [BC]: The BC responses are awaiting approval and will be in by Monday

Steve DelBianco [BC]: Itwas enlightening to go thru the questions.

Yvette Guigneaux: on track 3

Yvette Guigneaux: scrolling available if needed

Greg Shatan: I support the analysis relating to the IRP.

Julf Helsingius: I am Ok with moving on, just caught up with the text

Greg Shatan: Sorry if I missed an opportunity to checkmark that.

Julf Helsingius: Pretty clear, thanks!

Julf Helsingius: Much appreciated!

Nathalie Vergnolle: Cheryl, who will be taking the action?

Julf Helsingius: very loud

Yvette Guigneaux: Christopher you were muted - we unmuted you but your line is quite a bit loud

Yvette Guigneaux: we can hear you Christopher

Julf Helsingius: distorted due to volume being too high

Steve DelBianco [BC]: I was not able to understand CW. Can you repeat, Cheryl?

Yvette Guigneaux: Cheryl can you repeat Christopher's comment? a few have noted a distortion and couldn't hear

Steve DelBianco [BC]: no

Christopher Wilkinson: OK Thankyou CW

Steve DelBianco [BC]: Cheryl?

Julf Helsingius: I am happy with the conclusion

Steve DelBianco [BC]: SO/AC chairs have a standing email list and may convene calls and meetings at any time. That creates an appropriate and adequate forum for sharing of experiences and best practices on accountability to their respective stakeholders.]

Steve DelBianco [BC]: one of our group is showing as "Anonymous" when editing the Google Doc. Would prefer that individual identify themselves

Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO): agree EC is not a drumbeat I wondered what it might in the future trigger

Steve DelBianco [BC]: Agree, Greg. But what to do in our document to reflect your statement?

Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO): I think the this issue. still needs a lot more discussion and contemplating

Greg Shatan: I can go to the Google Doc in my copious free time....

Greg Shatan: You can't evaluate a particular car with an internal combustion engine, until you have adopted the idea that our cars will have internal combustion engines.

Steve DelBianco [BC]: don't agree, Greg. You can indeed evaluate a particular instance of an idea.

Greg Shatan: But you can't implement it without deciding to adopt something basic to its existence.

Steve DelBianco [BC]: Greg, you can decide to adopt a yoga exercise without caring at all about adopting the full culture of Yoga

Greg Shatan: It also depends on what weight you give to the "legislative history" of Willie's email. Since we've quoted his email we know now what is meant be a "mutual accountability roundtable."

Steve DelBianco [BC]: At this point, Sub Team 1 needs to come togheter and begin reviewing responses to our questions.

Greg Shatan: Steve, if you do that, it's not a Yoga exercise, it's just stretching.

Greg Shatan: I never metaphor I didn't like....

Steve DelBianco [BC]: we were asked to evealaute a particular exercise. That is iall

Greg Shatan: But the exercise assumes mutual accountability.

Steve DelBianco [BC]: it does not, Greg

Greg Shatan: It does if you read Willie's email.

Steve DelBianco [BC]: Willie uses the phrase "mutual accountability" but he proposes an exercise that is not abotu accountability

Steve DelBianco [BC]: THat said, Greg. I am glad to accept your proposed text for our report

Greg Shatan: He says "the purpose would be to create a space for mutual accuntability."

Greg Shatan: As does the three-liner.

Greg Shatan: Though in a more ambiguous way.

Greg Shatan: Or one might say, unintelligible way.

Greg Shatan: The third sentence is not even a sentence; it's a fragment.

Steve DelBianco [BC]: if easier for you, Gerg, just email me your proposed paragraph and I'll put it in the doc today

Greg Shatan: I can go into the Google doc, no problem. I'm sitting with three screens in a nice office....

Greg Shatan: December 15 = midnight at the oasis, for me.

Greg Shatan: Thank you, Cheryl, and thank you Steve for taking time out of IGF as well as all the hard work in the DT.

Tom Dale (ACIG GAC Secretariat): Thank you.

Julf Helsingius: Thanks all!

Greg Shatan: Bye all!

Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO): thanks everyone

Cheryl Langdon-Orr (CLO): bye for now