15:36:18 From Yeşim Saglam - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Welcome to At-Large Consolidated Policy Working Group (CPWG) Call taking place on Wednesday, 18 May 2022 at 13:00 UTC.
15:36:29 From Yeşim Saglam - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Agenda: https://community.icann.org/x/nwnCCw
16:01:45 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
Hello everyone
16:02:08 From Lilian Deluque to Everyone:
Hello Amrita and everyone
16:02:15 From Herb Waye Ombuds to Everyone:
Greetings from the Office of the Ombuds.
16:02:21 From Nthabiseng Pule to Everyone:
Hi veryone
16:03:35 From Yeşim Saglam - ICANN Org to Everyone:
RTT Link: https://www.streamtext.net/player?event=ICANN
16:05:10 From Christopher Wilkinson to Everyone:
AOB - I have a point aboout +++
16:05:50 From Christopher Wilkinson to Everyone:
AOB - I have a point about the Sub Pro ODP.
16:06:13 From Lutz Donnerhacke to Everyone:
Sorry, I'm late. 10km ride by bike through the City ...
16:07:00 From Gopal Tadepalli to Everyone:
Greetings. - Dr. T V Gopal, Professor, Department of Computer Science and Engineering, College of Engineering, Guindy Campus, Anna University , Chennai, INDIA.
16:08:44 From Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org to Everyone:
AIs: https://community.icann.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=184997399
16:12:05 From Steinar Grøtterød to Everyone:
@Oliver: Lutz and Daniel will do the reporting from the last Transfer PDP WG meeting
16:15:05 From Roberto Gaetano - NextGen Mentor to Everyone:
sorry folks, busy times, just got off the phone
16:19:27 From Eduardo Díaz - NARALO Chair to Everyone:
TThere is a typo. EPEP should be EPDP.
16:20:25 From Lianna Galstyan Լիաննա Գալստյան to Everyone:
Hi everyone, sorry for joining late
16:22:44 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
apologies for joining late.
16:26:25 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
makes sense
16:28:05 From Gopal Tadepalli to Everyone:
Thinking Aloud: Is "Military" Transparency a major concern specifically in Europe [a large land mass]? North India was said to prone to wars due to the land connectivity. If this is the case, I wonder if there will ever be any convergence within Europe on NIS2 or future series. Otherwise the core concerns are similar all over the globe. - Dr. T V Gopal, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
16:28:57 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
This is the press release on NIS2 https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2022/05/13/renforcer-la-cybersecurite-et-la-resilience-a-l-echelle-de-l-ue-accord-provisoire-du-conseil-et-du-parlement-europeen/
16:31:01 From Naveed to Everyone:
we can handle it later in future when necessary
16:31:32 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
It can takes 21 months for the member states to enact the directive into national law from the date it goes into force.
16:31:49 From Eduardo Díaz - NARALO Chair to Everyone:
LOng time indeeed.
16:32:14 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
Yep and they'll probably remember something that they left out. :)
16:35:28 From Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond to Everyone:
@Steinar: noted re: your reporting. Might I suggest Alan Greenberg goes first as he's got 2 updates and needs to leave at the top of the hour?
16:35:33 From Greg Shatan to Everyone:
21 months is shorter than an EPDP….
16:36:04 From Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org to Everyone:
@Hadia. -confirming you noted SAC120.
16:36:10 From Steinar Grøtterød to Everyone:
@Oliver: +1
16:36:23 From Greg Shatan to Everyone:
Sounds like we should have a SSAD SSAC discussion.
16:36:52 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
+1 Jonathan
16:37:07 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
sounds good we could compare responses and discuss
16:37:11 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Greg A Dutch member of the European parliament tried to get some sanity injected into some of the recitals but the European Commission rejected it. Hopefully, the new text will have some of these ideas included.
16:37:12 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
That makes sense
16:37:29 From Gopal Tadepalli to Everyone:
Suggested Topic for SSAC : "Connectedness 2030" - Dr. T V Gopal, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
16:39:45 From Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond to Everyone:
it would be interesting to discuss this informally first with the SSAC leadership and see if there is traction
16:41:27 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@CW While Twitter or facebook works on separating fake ids and bots, it can be done 'globally' by the DNS
16:41:29 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
Not quite sure how that would work. A registration is a registration is a registration.
16:42:53 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
for me not yet
16:43:05 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@ocl If we are discussing connectedness of the future, we could bring up quantum computing trends, meta, blockchain and identifiers in that environment which is not too far in the distant
16:43:13 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
it is all almost now
16:43:30 From Gopal Tadepalli to Everyone:
@Zuck & @Olivier: Nature Article on Technium that IMHO is a simple start now for "Connectedness 2030" is at: https://www.nature.com/articles/468372a - Dr. T V Gopal, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
16:45:01 From Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond to Everyone:
big by its significance :-)
16:48:13 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
#on proposed scenario 1,2,3&4# there could be another way, that of a new registration data design, harmoniously implemented by Registrars and Registries, that would in two years accumulate enough of Registration data, accurate to expectations.. Most of the Registration data at that point of time would be accurate, and the smaller proportion of data that is not accurate can have a different method or strategy for rectification.
16:48:42 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
SSAD design could built it in as a component of it.
16:48:53 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
... could build this in ....
16:51:44 From Steinar Grøtterød to Everyone:
@Alan: Suggestion #2: How to verify that the data from the registrars are valid?
16:52:31 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
There are different types of registrars (dropcatcher/retail/brand protection) and they tend to have different numbers of registrations. Some of the dropcatchers tend to only have the domain names for a short time before it is transferred to other registrars.
16:53:40 From Roberto Gaetano - NextGen Mentor to Everyone:
the Jeff Williams problem again?
16:54:01 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
as Steiner says, at present the Registration process is filling up a form - an address, sometimes verified (confirmed) and a phone number, often not verified, an address, which is a string of letters and numbers, it could be any, a name, can be any, a city, can be any.
16:54:15 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
The other factor with new registrations in gTLDs is that some gTLDs have approximately 80% plus non-renewal rates for first renewals. An audit or survey would need depth of historical, new and transferred/changed regs.
16:55:03 From Gopal Tadepalli to Everyone:
@Steinar: ICANN Request for Information on Identity Verification Methods for SSAD at: https://www.icann.org/en/announcements/details/request-for-information-on-identity-verification-methods-for-ssad-now-open-21-6-2021-en - Dr. T V Gopal, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
16:55:08 From Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond to Everyone:
Surely there should be some level of Trust between contracted parties?
16:55:41 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@John +1 for depth of historical registration data
16:55:44 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Olivier To quote President Reagan, trust but verify? :)
16:56:30 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
there are some services but it seems impractical, at this point
16:56:55 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
not cheap
16:57:41 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
Identity verification might be going a bit beyond the remit as it would be easier to verify geographical terms or syntax.
16:58:13 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
@Alan you are correct this is not practically possible
16:58:38 From Gopal Tadepalli to Everyone:
In verification it’s all about structure, discipline, accurate documentation and the desire for perfection. - Dr. T V Gopal, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
16:58:43 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@OCL Trust between registrars/registries would require transparency between them, to some level. Transparency will have its own rewards, in the sense that Transparency (between them) would also make it transparent as who is violating business code, such as who poaches another's customer, which would in the end go towards preserving good business practices.
16:59:08 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
Thank you Alan
16:59:47 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
Loud and clear.
17:00:17 From Steinar Grøtterød to Everyone:
On "proposal" to identify the registrant by use of passport etc: How to to make sure the registrars keep personal data in a safe way. Also have in mind the reseller model
17:01:14 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Steinar The Epik (registrar) hack was a bit of a nightmare for this kind of thing. It was an end to end hack of many of the registrar's servers.
17:01:38 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@Steiner It may not require passports to make registration data accurate, there could an entirely different schema
17:01:58 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
for an equal or greater level of accuracy.
17:02:30 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
Not passports to Registrars and resellers, I have had a personal bad experience.
17:02:31 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Siva Doesn't every Indian citizen have an Aadhaar (digital identity)?
17:03:00 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
Yes John, but why would i hand over my Aadhar to a reseller?
17:03:42 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
2
17:03:45 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
orry
17:03:57 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Siva That's also an argument for providing passport images to registrars. It is a very hard problem to solve.
17:04:20 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
If I can find a way to make sure that Registrar understands that the data I provide is accurate, WITHOUT sending the Registrar a copy of my passport, wouldn't you prefer such a schema?
17:04:26 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
@Siva - we do give Aadhar in many cases for authentication for purchase of domain. example dot in
17:04:56 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@John buy me a coffee at The Hague, I will tell you more.
17:05:19 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Siva probably won't get to the Hague. :)
17:06:20 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@Amrita... Not necessary. The level of disclosure can be achieved by different methods, not by showing my aadhaar to the vendor who sells me vegetable juice, or by giving my aadhaar to the hotel receptionist to make a scanned copy.
17:06:23 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
Thinking about this in cryptographic terms, it is an application for a Zero Knowledge Proof/
17:06:31 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
There are a number of European ccTLD that have been implementing Registrant verification into their respective business practices. While some are using national IDs, EURid is actually implementing a number of business practices that can verify registrants across various national jurisdicitions.
17:07:01 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@John I will share with you eventually.
17:07:18 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
@Siva -I guess here wer are speaking of domain names. Dot IN if I am not wrong is mandating aadhar for authentication
17:07:21 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
@John - it is less of a Zero Knowledge Proof and more of a Verifiable Credential
17:07:23 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@John Sparkling water first. Then coffee.
17:08:05 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@Amrita That needs to wait. That is not the right way to go.
17:08:24 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Michael Verifiable for the chain of registry/registrar/reseller but without any critically important info being exchanged.
17:08:40 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
... wait till i have my own website with my own ip address.
17:09:33 From Steinar Grøtterød to Everyone:
Re the TAC: The Registry can only verify a TAC (in the transfer process). The TAC cannot be seen in clear text by the Registry
17:09:46 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
@John - So pseudomized verified credentials?
17:10:22 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Michael Yep. It may be more secure initially.
17:11:25 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Michael The problem is that this kind of thing needs to be built into the system from the start and it is very difficult to add on later.
17:11:29 From Jonathan Zuck to Everyone:
do you mean non-exclusive or non-exhaustive?
17:13:28 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
Some of the EU registrars using this approach do so in countries with existing government identity schemes for citizens. That makes it easier for non-commercial registrants. Some of the business registrants also have a kind of digital footprint with business registration numbers/company numbers that are accessible online.
17:13:42 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
@John - respectfully disagree. It is possible to integrate pseudomized verified credentials in a phased approach, no need for a Thanos snap the finger moment.
17:14:34 From Sivasubramanian M to Everyone:
@Michael What is a Thanos snap the finger moment?
17:14:36 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Michael It is possible but it is a lot more difficult to back-engineer the system of registrations.
17:15:56 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
@John - eIDAS 2.0 and ISO 18013–5 are changing identity proofing - no longer just available to those countries with a national ID scheme
17:16:48 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Michael They sound interesting. Will check them out.
17:17:20 From Michael Palage to Everyone:
@John - Not difficult to back-engineer the systems of registrations, minimal changes to EPP extensions.
17:18:48 From Gopal Tadepalli to Everyone:
Thank you Mr. Satish Babu. Some useful definitions for IDL are found at Request for Comments: 3743, April 2004 at: https://www.ietf.org/rfc/rfc3743.txt [Chinese, Japanese, Korean IDN]. - Dr. T V Gopal, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
17:19:16 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
@Michael For small registries, perhaps. I still remember the time that Netsol decided to change its system. Best by e-mail.
17:21:47 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
@olivier those are the states related to variants.
17:21:57 From Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Talking Points space: https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/At-Large+Talking+Points+at+ICANN74
17:25:34 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
Will there be an option to select virtual or physical while registering?
17:27:37 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
@Amrita yes
17:27:40 From Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org to Everyone:
Please attend the 74. planning calls for the topic of ICANN74
17:27:59 From Greg Shatan to Everyone:
Bye all!
17:28:17 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
Registering for the IDN EPDP meeting showed both options
17:28:40 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
@Heidi thanks a lot. Unfortunately the planning calls are not time friendly for many parts of Asia
17:28:46 From Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org to Everyone:
We an add a. point on this to. next week's planning committee.
17:31:04 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
Thanks Jonathan
17:31:14 From Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org to Everyone:
I've. asked to. have this item on next week's 74 call.
17:31:29 From Hanan Khatib to Everyone:
thank you all
17:31:40 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
ok thanks
17:32:16 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
+1 Good measures
17:33:34 From Hadia El Miniawi to Everyone:
Thank you all bye for now
17:33:38 From John McCormac - HosterStats.com to Everyone:
Thanks and later all.
17:33:40 From Satish Babu to Everyone:
Thanks and bye!
17:33:42 From Amrita Choudhury to Everyone:
Thanks a lot. Bye all
17:33:52 From Herb Waye Ombuds to Everyone:
Very informative meeting. Thank you all. Au revoir. Stay safe and be kind.
17:34:11 From Lianna Galstyan Լիաննա Գալստյան to Everyone:
Thanks everyone
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At-Large Regional Policy Engagement Program (ARPEP)
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