00:27:13 Ejikeme Egbuogu: Hello everybody #IStandWithUkraine
00:27:58 Herb Waye Ombuds: Greetings everyone from the Office of the Ombuds. Looking forward to a respectful, professional and productive session. ombudsman@icann.org
00:28:28 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Sorry entering a bit late
00:28:29 Michelle DeSmyter - ICANN Org: Please note that chat sessions are being archived and are governed by the ICANN Expected Standards of Behavior: http://www.icann.org/en/news/in-focus/accountability/expected-standards
00:28:58 Oksana Prykhodko: Dear all, thank you very for organizing this call. Just today I have sent the letter regarding Ukrainian translation for ICANN meetings. Please consider this proposition
00:29:25 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: So glad to see you hear @Oksana
00:29:36 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: and hear you
00:29:39 Michelle DeSmyter - ICANN Org: Wiki page: https://community.icann.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=186784319
00:30:04 Oksana Prykhodko: Dear Cheryl, thank you very much! Me too!
00:30:23 Jeffrey Neuman: Can I clarify how I brought up the issue and what I said on the call?
00:31:06 Glenn: Lots of postings at the ICITY HUB site I oversee at https://www.facebook.com/groups/icityhub
00:32:32 Michelle DeSmyter - ICANN Org: https://community.icann.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=186784319
00:33:13 Michelle DeSmyter - ICANN Org: Please note that chat sessions are being archived and are governed by the ICANN Expected Standards of Behavior: http://www.icann.org/en/news/in-focus/accountability/expected-standards
00:33:30 Jonathan Zuck: Exactly
00:34:08 Frank Anati - ICANN73 fellow: hi everyone Frank Anati from Ghana
00:34:13 Glenn: https://domainincite.com/27570-namecheap-boss-goes-nuclear-on-russian-customers
00:34:52 Michelle DeSmyter - ICANN Org: A kind reminder to please state your name when speaking for our interpreters - thank you.
00:35:23 Raymond Mamattah: Greetings from Accra, Ghana.
00:35:58 Glenn: https://www.theverge.com/2022/3/3/22959816/sabre-cuts-ties-aeroflot-russian-invasion-ukraine
00:37:19 Marita Moll: Thanks for posting these links @Glenn. Very helpful
00:38:47 Marita Moll: Someone has to bell the cat @Jeff. We can't stick our heads in the sand.
00:39:47 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: We should note Roberto's recent email on these points raised by @Jeff as well I think here... as he is an apology.
00:39:53 Glenn: Update from the Economist
00:39:55 Glenn: https://www.economist.com/leaders/2022/03/05/when-vladimir-putin-escalates-his-war-the-world-must-meet-him?utm_medium=social-media.content.np&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=editorial-social&utm_content=discovery.content
00:40:14 Evan: Thanks, Glenn
00:40:37 Lutz Donnerhacke: EU imposes sanctions on Russian state-owned outlets Russia Today and Sputnik … this is really an attack to the stability and the function of the Internet :-(
00:40:51 Raymond Mamattah: Why must ICANN sanction the Russian citizens, I think that will be in a bad taste of taking sides. Have we done same during the US invading of Iraq and Afghanistan?
00:41:36 Bachollet Sebastien - Euralo: Roberto message
Dear all,
I have another commitment that I am unable to postpone, so, regretfully, I will not attend this call.
I will therefore paste below a contribution that I have provided to another list to provide my position for the topic at hand - and add a couple of comments to observations made yesterday in the chat.
I believe that ICANN does have a political role, the point is to be clear about what role and in favour of whom.
To resist the temptation to cut off pieces of the unique, interoperable Internet *is* a political position, whether it comes from Ukraine to close .ru or from the US to close .ly or .ir.
No matter how sad we are about the Russian invasion of Ukraine and how frustrated we are for not being able to do much, we have to understand that while us, as individuals, have these feelings, ICANN has to act taking a higher view of the issues at hand, abstracting from the current situation and holding tightly to general principles. And the general principle is that whatever results in
00:42:04 Jeffrey Neuman: The "sanctions" are just in the form of not providing benefits.
00:42:23 Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org: You have the floor, Christopher.
00:42:31 Evan: Hell has frozen over. I agree with Jeff.
00:42:41 Jeffrey Neuman: Thanks Evan ;)
00:42:44 Marita Moll: Would Lutz be able to speak about the new EU regs.
00:43:05 Lutz Donnerhacke: The EU sanctions should be set up using blocks on the IP Level (based on ASNs) and DNS Resolution. Hence it's likely to have a Major overblock
00:43:22 Michelle DeSmyter - ICANN Org: Please note that chat sessions are being archived and are governed by the ICANN Expected Standards of Behavior: http://www.icann.org/en/news/in-focus/accountability/expected-standards
00:43:37 Glenn: A good bit of news is the opening of safe travel zones. similar to what happened in Holland during the Hunger Winter of 1944
00:43:39 Jeffrey Neuman: Every country (even Switzerland) took a position :)
00:43:39 Glenn: https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2022/3/2/russian-troops-in-streets-of-kherson-mayor-says-liveblog
00:43:53 John McCormac - HosterStats.com: @Lutz Sometimes I wonder if the people in the EU admin really understand how simply and easily these bans can be circumvented.
00:44:24 Glenn: Interesting stats
00:44:25 Glenn: NATO has made : 14,500 dead in Libya 165,000 dead in Afghanistan 224,000 dead in Syria 1,200,000 dead in Iraq It didn't shock anyone. None of these countries has been sanctioned. Does NATO have moral grounds to rebuke Russia? #RussianUkrainianWar #Afghanistan
00:44:28 Lutz Donnerhacke: John: Nullrouting the IP space of an ASN is *very* hard to circumvent
00:45:05 John McCormac - HosterStats.com: @Lutz Switching IPs to different IPs on ASNs might cause problems with that.
00:46:09 Lutz Donnerhacke: Sanctions must be targeted, there are several good sanctions in place from bank blocks to removing support for the airospace carriers
00:46:09 Tendai Marengereke: As a citizen staying in a country that is sanctioned. Sanctions always affect the citizens more than the intended targets. I do not see the benefit in turning off Russia.
00:47:07 Lutz Donnerhacke: We have to concentrat on a functional and stable Internet in Ukraine! This is important.
00:47:11 Jeffrey Neuman: FYI - I am NOT advocating turning ICANN off at all.
00:47:26 Jeffrey Neuman: I mean Not advocating turning off Russia
00:47:37 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: Understood #Jeff
00:47:46 Harold Arcos: Thanks for sharing the Stats dear @Glenn, totally agree with your POV and question.
00:48:32 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: YES
00:49:45 Lutz Donnerhacke: Yes, Oksana!
00:50:06 Sarah Kiden: Good to see you here, Oksana. Sending hugs
00:50:30 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: without internet in Ukraine we would not ne hearing you now of course thanks for your intervention Oksana Stay SAFE!
00:51:05 Jeffrey Neuman: Oksana - I am so sorry for what you are going through and I really wish there were other things I could do personally other than donating money.
00:51:13 Lutz Donnerhacke: On the organisational Level ICANN can do something, like removing Voting Rights.
00:51:39 Evan: UN vote to deplore the invasion of Ukraine: 141 in favour 5 against (Russia Belarus, N. Korea,Eritrea, Syria) That is the difference.
00:51:54 Oksana Prykhodko: Dear Saran, thank you much!
00:52:01 Ejikeme Egbuogu: How can we provide financial aid to Ukraine
00:52:10 Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org: Sarah
00:52:12 Oksana Prykhodko: Ukrainian translation!!!!
00:52:30 Jonathan Zuck: that would have been a good idea, Oksana. Sorry!
00:53:31 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Totally agree SEB
00:54:12 Alfredo Calderon (ICANN73 Mentor): <Question>Who are we condoning? Individuals or the government.
00:55:13 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: essential points from the EURALO statement IMO I agree @Yrio
00:55:23 Lutz Donnerhacke: For everyday life, organizing direct help for Ukraine is possible and we are taking this road here. This is a different path than the official one.
00:55:34 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Yes SEB and Yrjo
00:56:27 Greg and Deborah: Glenn, It is not a “#RussianUkrainianWar.” It is a unilateral Russian invasion and attack on Ukraine.
00:56:28 Jeffrey Neuman: Its about being funded...not about participation.
00:56:41 Mouloud Khelif - ICANN73 Fellow: <Questions> Do we know if ICANN74 is going to be f2f (or hybrid)? Is there going to be any “travel”? Will Russian be able to fly to the Netherlands? (Russian planes are banned from EU airspace and EU planes bannes from RU airspace)?
00:56:47 Lilian Deluque: Oksana receive a hug from LAC
00:56:54 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: We need to have them supported no matter what is happen in their countries
00:57:06 Sandra Hoferichter, EuroDIG: Thinking of low hanging fruits on how to help: technical equipment like solar power banks, phones, international sim cards, other equipment with which an expert could set up an infrastructure etc. … if ICANN sends such stuff to the neighbouring countries and distribute it from there? Would that help?
00:57:06 Sarah Kiden: +1 Vanda
00:57:11 Evan: @Jeff... FWIW, I would go further and extend it to participation.
00:57:14 Marita Moll: Unfortunately, not funding means not participating for most At Large volunteers.
00:57:37 Jeffrey Neuman: @Marita - it also means the same thing for other parts of the ICANN community.
00:57:55 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: I haven’t seen Americans not be supported when invading Iraqis
00:58:41 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: I do not support barriers to engagement in ICANN, but I also think @Pari's point on what can be done positive as opposed to negative needs considerations here
00:58:44 Sarah Kiden: It sets a precedence that becomes very complicated
00:58:51 Bill Jouris: We have three possible route of action: technical, financial, and statements. The technical steps are generally difficult (or impossible). And we have inadequate information on who (Russian government or individuals) would actually be impacted. Fnancial steps come down to not spending money where it ends up in Russia. As for statements, there is no reason why ICANN, as an organization (ie. the Board) cannot put out a statement at least as emphatic as the UN.
00:58:53 Jeffrey Neuman: Ukrainian end users will likely not be able to come to the next ICANN meeting (in the Hague) because they are in the middle of war and likely cannot travel. That's not fair either. What are we going to do for them?
00:58:56 Raymond Mamattah: Plus One for Seun
00:59:04 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Support end users shall be independent of political situation
00:59:20 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: Absolutly @Vanda
01:00:12 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Help Ukrainians with connection shall be the focus
01:00:23 Mouloud Khelif - ICANN73 Fellow: @Pari +1
01:01:01 Oksana Prykhodko: Russians are affraid to show their disagreement with putler, that is why putler kills Ukrainian children and women. But I said not about punishment, but about support for Ukrainians - translation first of all
01:01:34 Yrjo Lansipuro: +1 Sandra
01:01:48 Lutz Donnerhacke: +1 Sandra, we are collecting such items, too
01:02:11 Greg and Deborah: I support the focus on support for Ukraine and Ukrainians, both at ICANN73 and in Ukraine. And in refugee camps etc.
01:02:26 Jeffrey Neuman: What ALS' are in Ukraine?
01:02:36 Vernatius Ezeama: dial out with this number +2348037007800
01:02:44 Kafui Amanfu: Inclusivity and access should not be undermined in any such case. For this reason ICANN should consider oneness and support for both regions than punitive measures.
01:02:45 Marita Moll: I like the comments from @Sandra. Is it possible for ICANN to do that or co-ordinate something like that
01:02:54 Claire Craig: Definitely sounds like a good idea Sandra, if it is possible
01:03:07 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: basics are often more important than we realize in these disaster (and war is just that!) circumstances @Sandra correct...
01:04:07 Lavish Mawuena Mensah: @Kafui, how is that possible when one has an "upper hand" over the other...
01:04:37 Bachollet Sebastien - Euralo: @Jeff European Media Platform
Oksana ALS
01:05:16 Jeffrey Neuman: Oksana - what can we do for you and your organization
01:05:29 Bachollet Sebastien - Euralo: @Jeff The Ukrainian Internet Association
01:05:46 Glenn: Perhaps support UNHCR
01:05:47 Evan: BAD BEHAVIOR?!?!?
01:05:47 Glenn: onate.unhcr.org/int/en/ukraine-emergency?m_i=Za5B7RZkz4c8CGXPnBKs9cciUseSg8rZG%2BGxhHwiUKvk0eS9J46_ecHpZpArXzn5eAgOpkBaOTxE_Pecnhf0527SsXTScNZZZ5&utm_source=Appeal&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=HQ_PS_EN_APPEAL_UA_1Million-milestone_220303_5&utm_content=&utm_term=&utm_email=HQ_PS_EN_APPEAL_UA_1Million-milestone_220303_5
01:06:25 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: well noted @Lutz
01:06:58 Glenn: donate.unhcr.org/int/en/ukraine-emergency?m_i=Za5B7RZkz4c8CGXPnBKs9cciUseSg8rZG%2BGxhHwiUKvk0eS9J46_ecHpZpArXzn5eAgOpkBaOTxE_Pecnhf0527SsXTScNZZZ5&utm_source=Appeal&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=HQ_PS_EN_APPEAL_UA_1Million-milestone_220303_5&utm_content=&utm_term=&utm_email=HQ_PS_EN_APPEAL_UA_1Million-milestone_220303_5
01:07:43 Lavish Mawuena Mensah: https://donate.unhcr.org/africa/en-af/ukraine-emergency?m_i=Za5B7RZkz4c8CGXPnBKs9cciUseSg8rZG%2BGxhHwiUKvk0eS9J46_ecHpZpArXzn5eAgOpkBaOTxE_Pecnhf0527SsXTScNZZZ5&utm_campaign=HQ_PS_EN_APPEAL_UA_1Million-milestone_220303_5&utm_content=&utm_email=HQ_PS_EN_APPEAL_UA_1Million-milestone_220303_5&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Appeal&utm_term=
01:07:51 Oksana Prykhodko: @Jeff To give more voices to our members - there are two more our members here
01:08:40 Jeffrey Neuman: @Oksana - are you in contact with them? How are they doing?
01:08:43 Glenn: @ johanathan an article The Guardian notes the bias on this conflict due to being European
01:09:15 Raymond Mamattah: The thought on my mind is, with this war does it mean Ukrain is just relaxed without fighting back in any way to affect the Russian citizens in no way at all? If not so, we have to consider support to End-Users in both countries.
01:11:38 Oksana Prykhodko: @Jeff - they Igor D are here just now. One of them is Igor Dubinsky, translator, another is Valerie Dubitska, Youth IGF-UA moderator
01:12:12 Greg and Deborah: @Raymond, Ukraine is hardly “relaxed”. It is extremely distressed. But Ukraine is not attacking the Russian people in any way. This is a very asymmetrical war.
01:12:14 Hadia’s iPhone: +1 Marita
01:12:50 Jeffrey Neuman: @Oksana and @Igor, please let us know what else we can do for you.
01:12:56 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: Igor and Valerie very glad you are able to join us here as well as Oksana
01:13:24 Jeffrey Neuman: And @Valleriia.....
01:13:42 Jeffrey Neuman: Are you all still in Ukraine?
01:13:56 Glenn: Outside of the Ukraine. Canada has a very large Ukrainian population dating back to the 1900's settling of the west see article https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/mar/03/canada-ukraine-diaspora-relief-efforts-russia-attack
01:14:17 Igor Dubinskyi: Thanks! I am currently outside Ukraine, will try to go there soon.
01:14:18 Glenn: The Visa fees have been waived for Ukrianian refugees to Canada
01:15:05 Hadia’s iPhone: Exploring means of providing technical support is also a possibility
01:15:08 Jeffrey Neuman: If any of you can make it to the US, my home is always open.
01:15:11 Oksana Prykhodko: @ Raymond - I will send you some information regarding our "relax"
01:15:11 Valeriia Dubytska (Ukraine): Thanks for support. As for now, I'm in Ukraine
01:15:29 Ismail: I think its absurd to even think of removing Russia from the root Dns. It should not be even discussed its preposterous
01:15:39 Raymond Mamattah: Thanks @ Oksana
01:17:36 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: @Valeriia I will add you to my regular thoughts of Oksana @Igor I understand well your need to return to your home and wish you well in that effort... all of you Stay as Safe as possible...
01:19:03 Oksana Prykhodko: Thank you very much!
01:19:08 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: That is nice to hear @Vanda
01:20:18 Glenn: Followup on Canadian Ukrainian population Canada is home to 1.4 million people of Ukrainian descent – the world’s second largest Ukrainian diaspora after Russia.
01:21:04 Evan: I have long maintained that ICANN exists in an alternate universe, and this conversation only cements this reality more than ever. The rest of the world knows that many of its punitive actions, scross industry sectors, are affecting ordinary Russians. THAT IS THE POINT. The population, which legitimizes its government, has been propagandized (using its own very-non-open Internet) that the military operation is not an invasion but just the cleaning out of Nazis (like the president, a Jew with holocaust survivors in his family). The whole point of the WORLD action (which outside of this bubble very much includes not only the entire EU but also Africa and Latin America nearly unanimously) is to send a message ro Russia and Russians that what their country is doing is not normal.
01:21:16 Marita Moll: And whether there is a way we can marshal our human networks at ICANN to assist citizens in Ukraine in their communications needs
01:21:20 Evan: I have said it elsewhere and I will say it again. ICANN and now here ALAC are demonstrating that they are on the wrong side of history. The only reason you will not be held accountable and judged is because, in the grand scheme of things, nobody cares what you think. When the dust settles ICANN's actions will be seen in the future as IBM's during WW2 and its long term future will be seen in that light. If even Jeff's miniscule suggestions can have no traction, there is little hope for a group that appears to prioritise infrastructure over people, a position I personally consider to be barbaric.
01:21:23 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: absolutely against any disruption to the DNS
01:21:38 Ejikeme Egbuogu: <question> can the internet acess reimbursement program financial aid be expanded for Ukraine
01:21:42 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: Communication is essential in these circumstances for all
01:22:05 Lavish Mawuena Mensah: +1 Cheryl
01:23:03 Jeffrey Neuman: We can of course expand the pandemic benefits for Ukraine, but the issue is that most cannot use it as many of them do not have a home much less the ability to attend ICANN sessions.
01:23:21 John McCormac - HosterStats.com: Perhaps help Ukranians with gTLD domain name fees (no charge for renewing UA registered domain names and get the registries onside for this)? That might be better than a merely symbolic gesture.
01:23:28 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Sure our Software Association here that is member of BC inside GNSO supported the idea of guarantee Security and Stability of the DNS
01:23:29 Glenn: I would assume that this great awaking will be repeated in other hot spots in the world in the future?
01:23:57 Lutz Donnerhacke: +1 for autorenew!
01:24:08 Bachollet Sebastien - Euralo: @Olivier +1
01:24:17 John McCormac - HosterStats.com: +1 autorenew Olivier
01:24:24 Jeffrey Neuman: I need to drop. But thanks for having this discussion. It is an important first conversation, but not the last.
01:24:36 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: ones priorities shift with circumstance indeed @Jeff, but @Oksana noted the benefit of access to a certain sat service provider meshwork as valuable for example that goes to facilitating communications
01:24:53 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: For ccTLD there used to be mirrors in an opposite country in the globe
01:25:11 Igor Dubinskyi: For better understanding, there is no chance of Ukrainians attending any meetings, as there are many days long queues of refugees at all borders, no planes at all as the airports are destroyed by Russian missiles and bombs.
01:25:19 Olivier MJ Crepin-Leblond: there are secondary nameservers for .UA in several places outside the country
01:25:33 Lutz Donnerhacke: RIPE is not insisting on fees from "complicated" countries. We had this with payments from the Iran in the last few years. It's a good idea to offer the same to UA
01:25:54 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: makes sense @Lutz
01:26:03 John McCormac - HosterStats.com: +1 Lutz
01:26:54 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: Thanks everyone worthy discussion IMO here today...
01:27:06 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Good idea Lutz
01:27:11 Herb Waye Ombuds: Please everyone carry this positive attitude forward in future conversations… stay safe and be kind.
01:27:27 Marita Moll: Thanks for the opportunity to get started on this discussion
01:27:29 Sarah Kiden: Thank you
01:27:33 Chokri Ben Romdhane: thank you all
01:27:33 Pari Esfandiari: Thanks everyone Stay safe
01:27:34 Herb Waye Ombuds: I have faith in you all
01:27:36 Cheryl Langdon-Orr: Bye for now :-) Stay SAFE!
01:27:37 Lutz Donnerhacke: Try to stay safe, Oksana and everybody who is currently in this conflict
01:27:38 Evan: Doesn't matter anyway. If the US wants to step up sanctions it will be able to compel ICANN to do what it wants.
01:27:38 Heidi Ullrich - ICANN Org: Thanks, All,
01:27:43 Seun Ojedeji: Thanks everyone regards
01:27:44 Silvia Vivanco - ICANN Org: Thank you all!
01:27:45 Lavish Mawuena Mensah: Thanks
01:27:46 iPad (27)Vanda Scartezini: Thank all stay safe ,
