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  Terri Agnew:Dear all, Welcome to the At-Large Ad-hoc WG on IANA Transition & ICANN Accountability call on  Monday, 04 May 2015  at 13:00 UTC

  Terri Agnew:meeting page: https://community.icann.org/x/roA0Aw

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:Hello !

  Leon Sanchez:Hello everyone

  Alberto Soto:Hello everyone!

  Heidi Ullrich:Welcome, All!

  Leon Sanchez:I have a very bad throat and can barely speak so I will do my best when time comes for me to speak

  Terri Agnew:@Leon, I hope you are feeling better soon

  Leon Sanchez:Thanks Terri!

  Terri Agnew:20 April 2015 Action items:  https://community.icann.org/x/NSYnAw

  Fatima Cambronero:hello everyone / I am here now. Thanks

  Terri Agnew:IANA Stewardship Transition Coordination Group Issues Proposal Assembly and Finalization Process and Updated Transition Process Timeline:  https://www.icann.org/news/announcement-2-2015-01-07-en

  Terri Agnew:Welcome Gordon Chillcott

  Gordon Chillcott:Hello.  Sorry I

  Gordon Chillcott:Sorry I'm late

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:ICG, Handling Community Comments, https://www.ianacg.org/icg-files/documents/Community-Comments-Handling-1May15-final.pdf 

  Terri Agnew:Master schedule of all Meetings (including Design Teams): https://community.icann.org/x/6grxAg

  Terri Agnew:Two briefing webinars on 24 April: https://community.icann.org/x/ryYnAw

  Terri Agnew:@Jean-Jacques, we are unable to hear you

  Terri Agnew:6 May from 13:00 – 14:30 UTC (time zone converter here)7 May from 06:00 – 07:30 UTC (time zone converter here) Send an email to brenda.brewer@icann.org and indicate which time you would like to attend the webinar.

  Sébastien:All the 4 Webinars are supposed to be the same?

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:I was saying: in ICG calendar, last deadline is 20 May, closing date for expected public comment.

  Fatima Cambronero:I have the same question than @Sebastien

  Heidi Ullrich:ALAC PC workspace: https://community.icann.org/pages/viewpage.action?pageId=52898396

  Fatima Cambronero:when is the deadline to receive comments?

  Fatima Cambronero:@Alan, this is the story in LACRALO! Comments via email that someone have to edit...

  Gordon Chillcott:I agree, Alan

  Alan Greenberg:That is not to say that we cannot put forward some specific area where we are clealy very split. But the overall statement should (in my mind) not just be a compilation.

  Avri Doria:I think RALO contributing their own comments is a also a good idea.  Kind of like the various SGs in GNSO contributing their own.

  Fatima Cambronero:@Terri my call was drooped

  Terri Agnew:@Tijani and Fatima, calling both back

  Fatima Cambronero:thanks @Terri

  Alan Greenberg:At least PART of what we need to do is to identify what issues will cause us, as a chartering organization, to reject the final report.

  Terri Agnew:Tijani is back on audio

  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Thanks Terri

  Terri Agnew:Fatima is back on audio

  Fatima Cambronero:thanks Terri

  Terri Agnew:Welcome Carlton Samuels

  Carlton Samuels:Morning all

  Avri Doria:you can alwasy submit an extra stmt with the things that can't be said alongside the template.

  Alan Greenberg:The eis a box at the end for "IS THERE ANYTHING ELSE YOU WANT TO SAY?"

  Alan Greenberg:There is a ...

  Avri Doria:yeah, but sometimes those boxes are of limited size.

  Gordon Chillcott:Also there is a box for "General Comments".

  Carlton Samuels:And while we are at it, be prepared to receive even less than the 4% response reserved for these kinds of surveys!

  Carlton Samuels:...and the language is another thing!

  Leon Sanchez:we are respectful of tradition

  Carlton Samuels:Can I ask a question. Do we seriously believe this template will do for our ALS?

  Avri Doria:that papaer was an action item for the CWG. and is meant to describe the current state of discussion on an issue not yet decdied.

  Carlton Samuels:I would strongly suggest that if we have a ghost - I say ghost! - of a chance to get anything useable back, we distill the survey to no more tthan 4 TOP OF MIND issues and ask those.

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:Terri, could you please provide the link to this document from Sidley? Thanks.

  Terri Agnew:@Jean-Jacques, they are linked in the agenda

  Terri Agnew:Agenda item 4b

  Alan Greenberg:LL COMPANY

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:LLC

  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Reminder of Agenda page location: https://community.icann.org/x/roA0Aw

  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:Agenda Item 4b indeed.

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Tijani +1.

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Sébastien: I'm not suggesting that the operations of PTI should be outside the USA. I'm simply talking about THE OVERSIGHT BODY, which would be PTI Board.

  Carlton Samuels:@Sebastien: By gum, you've got it!   So long as we agree all must be vested in ICANN then all these questions are fluff!  Delaware or California the difference in detail is irrelevant! And I dare anybody to contradict that!

  Terri Agnew:For the webinars held week 27 April : The transcripts will be translated in the 5 UN languages and posted on the CWG-Stewardship Wiki here: https://community.icann.org/x/ryYnAw

  Fatima Cambronero:I have to go from the AC but I am still on the phone. thank  all, bye

  Carlton Samuels:Which is why that long 30+ questionnaire is largely an exercise in sophistry! There is not intent to deliver any greater understanding. And asking ALS that don't have a history of responding to anything that challenges an ADD-afflicted child is a nonstarter!

  Carlton Samuels:@Alan: Delaware IS the place because of the tax, governance and reporting !  We can get the Cliff Notes on that

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Carlton: your sociological explanation is of course true. The question is: should ALAC accept that as immutable? Is that in the longer-term interests of the global Internet user?

  Carlton Samuels:@Alan: What is the principle that is ast stake here?

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Alan, that is precisely what incumbents always count on.

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Alan and @Sébastien: I don't mind "wasting my time" in defense of a principle, and in the interests of the global users we purport to represent...

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Alan: and I don't even have the impression of "fighting a stupid thing"...

  Carlton Samuels:@Senastien: By gum, you've got it again!  We need to read the thing correctly.  That PTI Board cannot be ever in a situation where it challenges the decision of the Multistakeholder Community as exemplified by the ICANN Board! [Yes, the ICANN Board was intended to reflect the values of the Community. The problem is a sociological one; the Board of an American Corporation has certain values and they follow those, regardless. The tenmsion between ICANN Board and the rest of the Community is enduring and will continue.  I actually think that is a good thing!]

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Tijani: not INTEGRATED or SEPARATED. My suggestions simply considers that if there is to be a PTI Board, well let's ask for it to be meaningful, independent, and under a separate jurisdiction.

  Avri Doria:The CWG proposal does not have to do with not trusting the Board.  It has to do with the necessary separation between policy making and operations. 

  Leon Sanchez:No problem!

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Olivier: yes, CSC is less adapted to globalization than PTI Board, for the reasons you just mentioned (legal entity or not).

  Terri Agnew:Welcome Tom Lowenhaupt

  Carlton Samuels:@Alan: Question: So you would not support a PTI  whether it is a California or Delaware Corporation?

  Tom Lowenhaupt:Thank you.

  Carlton Samuels:@Alan: The issue for the PTI is that it is a membership organisation with one member, ICANN!

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Tijani and @Olivier: +1.

  Carlton Samuels:That configuration keeps everything in the ICANN family.

  Carlton Samuels:@OCL: When I say ICANN 'family' that is exactly what I mean. We utilize existing structures and channels

  Alan Greenberg:@Carlton, No, I can accept a PTI wholly controlled/ownd by ICANN. Not optimal in my mind, but managable. What I have a real problems is with is seprated copts that somehow are linked together and control each other. To a large extent the PTI subsidiary is really a way to spend legal and accounting money and not really do a lot else, since the PTI  will ultimately be fully controlled by ICANN.

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:Olivier and All: to go beyond this interesting discussion, may I suggest that the legal expert (Sidley) be asked to study the hypothesis of forming the PTI Board (and not CSC, sorry if I contributed to any ambiguity on this chat) under a separate jurisdiction? They could be asked to look at obstacles and advantages?

  Alan Greenberg:We are almost out of time and have not spent any time on CCWG Acct. I REALLY want a fewminutes on that!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  Carlton Samuels:@Alan: Not sure what you mean by separated c"opts" linked together and control each other.  If you mean 'cost's then I have one advisory. Form ever follows function!

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:extend  by a short but

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:bit

  Carlton Samuels:You cannot have separate money and not run the risk of a runaway entity!

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Olivier, if you could just look at my latest remark here in the chat (above).

  Terri Agnew:CCWG Accountability: https://community.icann.org/x/IIMHAw

  Alan Greenberg:@Carlton, it was "corps"

  Avri Doria:i agree Alan,  i understand turning the ACSO into UA, but the shadow UA makes me concerend.

  Carlton Samuels:@Alan: OK. Look at the organisation of a Korean chaebol. For that is the closest thing I see to what is the objective.

  Avri Doria:Legal advice has said the laibilty issue is the same as it is now.

  Leon Sanchez:the saying of the lawyers is that liability would not increase if whatever it would decrease

  Avri Doria:we are already liable we just dont know it.

  Carlton Samuels:@Alan: +1

  Alan Greenberg:@Avri, turning an AC/SO into an UI will not work for some (as the ccNSO), and will also open up liability issues.

  Leon Sanchez:Exactrly Avri. That's the lawyers' point

  Alan Greenberg:UI=UA

  Alan Greenberg:Leon, we can talk further....

  Leon Sanchez:yes. I can try

  Olivier Crepin-Leblond:@Jean-Jacques - I have read  your suggestion and I will ask at the end of this call whether there are any objections to us asking this from Sidley

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Olivier: thanks.

  Carlton Samuels:@All: Y'all would be tired to see some faces in the [U.S.] District Court.  :-)

  Alan Greenberg:I freely admit I have not read the recent legal advice.

  Tijani BEN JEMAA:sorry, I have to leave now

  Tijani BEN JEMAA:bye

  Leon Sanchez:bye Tijani. good day

  Tom Lowenhaupt:+Cheryl

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Olivier, I suggest we follow your suggestion.

  Leon Sanchez:we can split them and also sharing the burden so everyone can have their own 1 am call :-)

  Jean-Jacques Subrenat:@Sébastien +1.

  Alan Greenberg:I have to leave!

  Terri Agnew:goodbye Alan

  Heidi Ullrich:Thanks, All. Good call.

  Carlton Samuels:Interesting discussion this morning!  Bye all

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:Bye

  Alberto Soto:Thanks, bye all!!

  Alberto Soto:Thanks Sabrina!!

  Tom Lowenhaupt:Sleep tight Cheryl.

  Carlton Samuels:I notice y'all didn't do much from the chat!

  Gordon Chillcott:Bye, all

  Yasuichi Kitamura:bye, all

  Carlton Samuels:Some of us cannot speak at this time!!

  Leon Sanchez:bye all

  Cheryl Langdon-Orr:bye