Nathalie Peregrine:Dear all, welcome to the NCSG meeting on the 6th May 2014
Magaly Pazello:Hello!
Rudi Vansnick:hello
Heather Leson:hello
Heather Leson:brb
Magaly Pazello:Ok. Thanks Rafik.
Heather Leson:back
Amr Elsadr:Hi all. Dialling in now.
Bill Drake:bonjour
Nathalie Peregrine:Subi Chaturvedi has joined the call
Bill Drake:budget in AOB
Bill Drake:not there
Subi Chaturvedi:Hi everyone. Thanks Nathalie.
Nathalie Peregrine:Maria Farrell has joined the call
Avri Doria:I am inclined against the prop 13 motion on obth proces and substance.
Nathalie Peregrine:Kathy Kleiman has joined the call
Kathy:Amr - do we have allies in voting no?
Avri Doria:has anyone checked with the registrars? i know they have wavered.
Avri Doria:personally i do not care if i have an ally on my vote in this.
Nathalie Peregrine:deedee Halleck and Stephanie Perrin are on the audio bridge
Stephanie Perrin:Hi everybody!
Avri Doria:i think the principle issue is too large.
maria farrell:Thanks so much, Amr. You have confinced me, too.
maria farrell:convinced...
Kathy:But is there anyone who supports us? Can we be effective in blocking it, if that is what you recommend?
Bill Drake:merci Amr
Amr Elsadr:;-)
Amr Elsadr:@Avri..., an issue was also raised on how this policy could be gamed if the TLD would be opened to public registration at a later date.
Amr Elsadr:I don't see how this gaming issue is related though, but it was a point that was raised by the registrars.
Kathy:I agree with Avri about that
Kathy:there is always gaming :-)
Kathy:and every rule opens up opportunities for more
Avri Doria:i have already done so.
Avri Doria:they want what they want.
Kathy:great, glad to know the dialogue is going...
Kathy:they (the Brands) wanted a private negotiation with ICANN
Avri Doria:are they part of the RySG, i.e are they a RySG interst group. They are playing. a game already
Avri Doria:do what I want. Let just shut down he GSNO.are we going to succumb to these threats? I will lose faith if you don't
Avri Doria:they have had 2 years to request a PDP!
Kathy:Tx Amr!!!!!!!!
Avri Doria:i will certainly make all my points during th discussion. i have made them already to Jonathan and others andd will do so again during the meeting.
Kathy:It all sounds very well reasoned
Kathy:Tx for taking the time to explain
Rudi Vansnick:i'm agreeing with Amr's proposals as well as with Avri's points
Heather Leson: thank you for this great discussion and all your work. I need to step away for my work. Have a good day.
Amr Elsadr:thanks kathy.
David Cake:Hi everyone, sorry I'm late.
Avri Doria:and there have been some email discussions.
David Cake:Do we have incoming Adobe audio on this call?
David Cake:i.e. can I talk with my mic, or do I need to dial in?
maria farrell:yes david, I think so. but you have to change the phone image in the tool bar to microphone.
Olevie:Hi !
Seun:Hello Olevie
Stephanie Perrin:seems to be working fine for me...
Amr Elsadr:Hi Olevie.
Seun:Hei everyone
Amr Elsadr:Hey Seun.
Olevie:Hi Seun
Subi Chaturvedi:Question for Amr. How will be reach out to the boarder IG community? Who will seek inputs, assimilitate them? is there a structure in place already? And what are we doing to include diverse voices especially from developing countries and emerging economies?
Olevie:Hi Amr
Olevie:I'm finally IN
Olevie:The Room
Olevie:Who is talking now please
Seun:May i know what we are discussing right now (apologies for coming in late, got denied login for a few times)
Olevie:?
rafik:@seun item 5
Olevie:Internet Governance Issues
Seun:Thanks @Rafik
Avri Doria:i think it is an excellen opportunity for an ex council member
Avri Doria:or members
Avri Doria:but in any case, i beleive eve if non council, council is repsinsible for choosing.
Bill Drake:registries uber alles
Avri Doria:yeah Bill, maybe you are right. lets leave it up to the registries.
Bill Drake:I hope your irony is understood
Brenden Kuerbis:Item 5 of the GNSO agenda. Which is item II. in the agenda for this meeting:http://listserv.syr.edu/scripts/wa.exe?A2=NCSG-DISCUSS;8da64bc5.1405
Avri Doria:i think it is a polocy matter, and that is what the council is chosen tot deal with. council then takes it to SG using the patterns it alwasy does, but it is the council process to manage.
Amr Elsadr:@Subi: That's a good question. This CCWG should not be limited to the ICANN community, although I would personally hope the discussion wouldn't be diluted by irrelevant IG issues not specific to the transition.
Brenden Kuerbis:What is the time alloted for this call? Just trying to figure out when each agenda item will be discussed.
Avri Doria:noting has happend other than ICANN STaff has taken unilateral action and we are all sputtering.
Subi Chaturvedi:Just the transition
Subi Chaturvedi:?
Bill Drake:who's sputtering? :-0
Amr Elsadr:Subi..., I also had a little trouble hearing you. Could you type your question in the chat?
Subi Chaturvedi:Thanks Avri :)
Avri Doria:the whole icann community.
Avri Doria:aand we atring to comment.
Avri Doria:the existing CCWG has forsworn anything to do with this sissue. so it is now a n Ac/SO orpha issue.
Avri Doria:i am against the creation of yet another ccwg
Amr Elsadr::)
Avri Doria:i think the GNSO should just particpate in the sterring committee
Subi Chaturvedi:Certainly. Amr. I asked Where are we right now? When we say next steps What do we mean? Has someone initiated a Working group to address this> and how will we integrate comments and inputs?
Marilia Maciel:actually the existing ccwg was gently pushed out of ianna transition :)
Brenden Kuerbis:I dont really see the point of CCWG w/r/t IANA transition if anyone if allowed to comment, and SOs are included in "steering" (or whatever) committee
Avri Doria:As I said Subi, we are at the starting gate, trying to figure out what to do.
Subi Chaturvedi:So that the transition is timely, relevant and time bound/ with stakeholders having a somewhat equitable contribution.
Amr Elsadr:@Marilia: I didn't get a sense of the gentle push. It felt more like an aggressive tackle to me!! :)
Bill Drake:'decided by icann'
Subi Chaturvedi:Thank Avri. Hope the spade will hit the soil, soul and strike the right chord.
Seun:I agree with Brenden, the IANA tansition has would have a steering committee(or cordination committee depending on what gets accetped)
Kathy:Do we have to do a review of the GNSO now??
Rudi Vansnick:indeed, there are no clear criteria defined yet
Rudi Vansnick:The work methods are expected to include the following:• Examination of documentation, records and reports.• Outcomes from the 360 Assessment, an online mechanism to collect and summarize feedback from members of the GNSO structure, interested members from ICANN community and other structures, members of the Board and staff.5• Integration of Assessments of the Second Accountability and Transparency Review Team – see Appendix A of the Second Accountability and Transparency Review Team Report and Recommendations (http://www.icann.org/en/about/aoc-review/atrt/final-recommendations-31dec13-en.pdf).• Limited interviews, if needed.
Bill Drake:happy to see so many people joining the call...
Amr Elsadr:Ray Plazk had said that the review would be a quantitative analysis of the GNSO. Not sure how that will work. I think a qualitative one would be more helpful, but I am not following this issue very closely.
Rudi Vansnick:ICANN will supply the criteria to be used in conducting the GNSO Review; these criteria include but are not limited to the following areas, to be applied to GNSO structure components (GNSO Council, GNSO Working Groups, GNSO Stakeholder Groups and Constituencies):• Achievement of mission, compliance with agreed upon rules and processes• Accountability and transparency to the public• Membership processes and participation• Structural support toward achievement of mission• Governance and management: effectiveness of execution• Quality and evaluation/measurement of outcomes• Communication• Effectiveness of implementation of prior review recommendations
Subi Chaturvedi::) push shove this et tu but just think we have to find a way to engage and amplify contributions
maria farrell:ah, thanks rudi! I had just found it and was about to paste...
Subi Chaturvedi:yes Avri
rafik:SIC doesnt mean SICK :)
Bill Drake:pasting large text blocs in the chat not always the easiest thing to deal with
rafik:SIC = structural improvements committee
Brenden Kuerbis:Yes, a link would be better!
Bill Drake:sicken the world
Subi Chaturvedi:very helpful Avri. Spread the warmth Bill
Bill Drake:nice bumper sticker
Amr Elsadr:@Avri, do you know how the independant examiner is selected? Does the lowest bidder win the RFP?
Amr Elsadr::)
Avri Doria:Bylaws + SIC
Avri Doria:are repsonsible for the timing, the delay was becasue the GNSO requested the deay
Avri Doria:but not is the time we delayed until.
Avri Doria:but now is the time ...
Kathy:Tx Rafik!
Brenden Kuerbis:See what Kathy means about being overworked...
Olevie:Add me in please
Amr Elsadr:@Kathy, the discussions on the delayed review's revival started before the NTIA announcement.
Bill Drake:maybe you were talking to yourself Avri
Brenden Kuerbis:new meaning to multistakeholder
David Cake:I just found out I was drafted onto it today. I'll try to make it in the future.
Bill Drake:Joy in the GNSO
Avri Doria:multstakeholder at all levels. and icann is top down.
Avri Doria:it is a corporations with a president. it is multstakeholder but bottom-up is a fantasy.
Avri Doria:But IDN variants is a fascinating topic in an of itself.
Amr Elsadr:LGR = Label Generation Rules and IDN = Internationalized Domain Names for those not familiar with ICANN acronyms. :)
Amr Elsadr:The WHOIS abuse study was awful!! :)
Amr Elsadr:I'm sorry..., I meant the p/p abuse study.
Amr Elsadr:privacy/proxy
Kathy:Sorry Amr, I remember one study was good and I don't remember the other study right now.
Amr Elsadr:Yeah Kathy..., you're right.
Kathy:The Carnegie Mellon Study was good...
Olevie:Thanks @Amr
Amr Elsadr:I got the titles mixed up.
Kathy:No, at least you remember them :-)
Bill Drake:what are we doing so far ahead of schedule? I feel disoriented...
Subi Chaturvedi:Item 9
Subi Chaturvedi:Planning for London
Bill Drake:I know Subi, I was joking, we often run over
Subi Chaturvedi::) My cup runneth over now
Klaus Stoll:I need to go soon, Please update us on the Seat 14 situation and also the NCSG Charter review in AOB. I think these are important issues
Subi Chaturvedi:Has the change been confirmed? are we going with option 1?
rafik:@klaus no update for seat 14, we have call with csg tomorrow
Amr Elsadr:@Klaus..., is there a review of the NCSG charter going on?
Klaus Stoll:I think we need a review of the NCSG Charter. it's hopelessly out of sink with the current realities
Olevie:+1@Klauss
Klaus Stoll:we should start seriously to think about it
Amr Elsadr:It's the new charter!! Recently reviewed!! :)
Amr Elsadr:There are things in the charter I don't like either, but was not aware others thought so. I'm not sure what your beef with it is.
Nathalie Peregrine:Robin Gross has joined the call
Klaus Stoll:It's not fair towards NPOC for example
rafik:@amr what review of charter?
Klaus Stoll:I am asking to start the process to review the NCSG Charter
Amr Elsadr:I'm not aware of any review. First I hear about it now.
Bill Drake:nothing is being shared
Magaly Pazello:@Klaus as much as I remember it was reviewed in an open consultation method.
Bill Drake:am I alone in losing sound?
Avri Doria:any group of members can make a recommendation to ammend the charter anytime they want.
Stephanie Perrin:hello? no sound, did i lose you all?
Rudi Vansnick:i lost audio
Seun:i lost it too but its back now
Brenden Kuerbis:I can hear you. we've lost our chair?
Nathalie Peregrine:Rafik had dropped
Avri Doria:i think dong an NCSG full charter review t this time would be overkill.
Nathalie Peregrine:he has re entered the AC room, we're wating for him on the bridge
Klaus Stoll:Sorry, I need to go, let's talk about a charter review when we have more time
Brenden Kuerbis:please put iut on agenda if you want to discuss something
Rudi Vansnick:i also have some problems
Magaly Pazello:@Avri, yes good to mention.
Avri Doria:but if a group of people think something needs to be fixed, they should recommend a fix and we should go through the charter ammenment process.
Subi Chaturvedi:If we can give both of them enough time. Both the transition and the accountability issues require a longer discussion. ICANN accountability needs to come from outside ICANN. Agree with Amr though.
Olevie:As he framework is changing, we probably need to amend the charter; I support Kluass
Stephanie Perrin:Can someone send us the reasons we need a charter review offline? I am afraid we spend a lot of time on calls talking process....perhaps we could do that on the list, it would help us focus.
Rudi Vansnick:happend today already in 2 other calls, looks like it has soemthing to do with the bandwidth of the platform
Stephanie Perrin:I would like to make a point about London Planning.
Bill Drake:no!
Subi Chaturvedi:We hear you now Rafik.
Nathalie Peregrine:Stefania Milan has joined the call
Bill Drake:grrrr...Adobe!
Subi Chaturvedi:Stephanie wants to speak
Subi Chaturvedi:yes
Robin:Hi folks!
Amr Elsadr:Hey there Robin. :)
Robin:Yes, Stephanie! Let's do the privacy meeting!
Subi Chaturvedi:+1 Stephanie
Magaly Pazello:+ 1
Robin:Hi Amr!
Subi Chaturvedi:Excellent
Rudi Vansnick:@Stephanie is on the agenda tomorrow in NCSG PC
Seun:are we not discussing item IV?
Brenden Kuerbis:We are not there yet
Brenden Kuerbis:Still on item III
Stephanie Perrin:YEs!!
Seun:thanks
Robin:I"m volunteering for the privacy event.
Stephanie Perrin:Kathy had to drop off...I can volunteer
Subi Chaturvedi:I'd like to volunteer as well Stephanie
Olevie:You're welcome Roin
Olevie:Robin
Marilia Maciel:volunteer too
Seun:I can volunteer if i know what the proxy and privacy is all about
Amr Elsadr:Stephanie..., we can hear you.
Brenden Kuerbis:Stefanie, we can hear you
Seun:if i have the url to the survey then i can increase the number by 1 :)
Stephanie Perrin:I will dig it up and send it out to the list
maria farrell:sure thing, rafik
Brenden Kuerbis:https://docs.google.com/document/d/1-Oe-kqA-5WXGavAy40XEHVzKltNAQrjiuuZ-FH5jJqw/edit?usp=sharing
Subi Chaturvedi:yes
Stephanie Perrin:I forwarded the survey to both lists...
Seun:Thanks @Stephi
Marilia Maciel:brenden are you looking for support to this contribution you put together or is it better to make additional contributions on the same direction?
Milton:We have only a few hours to submit it, so we are looking for support
Amr Elsadr:I've already supported it on the NCSG-PC list.
Subi Chaturvedi:+1 Brenden
rafik 2:@marilia it was shared at PC and as PC member you can vote there :)
Marilia Maciel:ok, could u share please? i probably missed it
Marilia Maciel:catching up :)
Milton:The link is here in the chat
Rudi Vansnick:will jump into the document later this evening
Marilia Maciel:But i what i asked is if u are looking for support of individual organization
Amr Elsadr:@Marilia..., it was sent to both the NCSG and NCSG-PC list. You didn't get it?
Brenden Kuerbis:Yes, that would be accurate thanks Rafik
Seun:Whats the deadline to making further comment?
Marilia Maciel:mail box still a mess. but will search when i arrive at the office
Brenden Kuerbis:end of day
Milton:end of today
Seun:what timezone @Brenden?
Robin:I support this document, Brenden.
Brenden Kuerbis:Thx Robin
Seun:Its funny right ;)
Rudi Vansnick:working on it ... we discussed yesterday part of it
Avri Doria:cool, thanks just wanted to make sure.
Brenden Kuerbis:@seun, i think ICANN close of business (pacific time) was suggested
Robin:I support what Amr is saying about not letting inaction slow down NCSG as a general rule (not just this one issue).
Brenden Kuerbis:may 8 id deadline
Rudi Vansnick:indeed, that's why i proposed tomorrow morning
Amr Elsadr:No apologies needed. :)
Robin:I don't agree that we have to wait for members of both constituencies to speak. I think the obligation is on the constituency to speak up if they don't like something.
Seun:+1 to Avri's comment
Amr Elsadr:In this case, we need an NCUC agreement as well.
Bill Drake:A principled stand Avri. Would be easier if we didn't have to go through this, though.
Seun:so a suggestion to make a notification call to the list now in that regard would be Ideal
Robin:the NCSG does not operate based on what the constituencies think. the ncsg operates based on what ncsg membership thinks.
Bill Drake:who's typing with their mic on?
Marilia Maciel:louder please. on mobile :)
Robin:can't hear Milont
Amr Elsadr:+1 @Robin.
Subi Chaturvedi:can't hear
Amr Elsadr:on NCSG decision-making
Brenden Kuerbis:He said, if ppl have questions, please ask them now as it would speed things up.
Milton:My comment: if you have questions or concerns, raise them NOW!
Robin:not good to have policies that incentive passivity as a way of killing documents.
Seun:whats the conclusion on what route to take as per Avri's comment?
Robin:I don't have audio.
Bill Drake:I've expressed reservations elsewhere about the precise framing of the structural sep stuff but I don't want to mess up the process on short time line if everyone else is happy
Robin:but I did reach out to privacy commissioners to invite them to come meet with ICANN comunity
Robin:and will continue to follow up.
Marilia Maciel:one thing it is necessary is a concise concept note outlining what are the issues
Robin::-)
Marilia Maciel:please lets say what is at stake and how it impacts real lives
Marilia Maciel:that would help to bring some more cs folks on board
Subi Chaturvedi:+1 Marilia. We do need to outline and articulate the issues at hand
Bill Drake:workshop off site a problem logistically
Marilia Maciel:yes, london helps as place
Marilia Maciel:lets rock
Subi Chaturvedi:yes Stephanie. Quite helpful. Perfect.
Stephanie Perrin:we still have the entire policy to write folks....plus I am still rounding up serious privacy goofs at ICANN....like the policy for pictures.
Robin:no doubt a long list...
Amr Elsadr:To be honest, I'm a bit puzzled on the scope of the privacy issues we're addressing here.
Bill Drake:we should keep clear ICANN's organizational approach to privacy from ICANN policy outputs
Brenden Kuerbis:Agree. We can sggest they need to hire a CPO, but lets keep DNS policy issues separate.
Marilia Maciel:i dont have the substance, but can help with format etc
Marilia Maciel:steph, lead us :)
Marilia Maciel:open a doc, we can work
Stephanie Perrin:Right now, they have separate policies for each area....or not. I agree the scope has to be clear, that I think is explained in the draft document although I could be mixing this up with what I tried to get into the EWG document....
Bill Drake:you still can't hear me?
Bill Drake:damn
Robin:can't hear you bill
Bill Drake:let me quit and reenter
Stephanie Perrin:Bascially there are two aspects, ICANN as data controller, ICANN as data processer
Bill Drake:no idea why
Robin:can't hear bill
Bill Drake:volume and other settings all fine
Rudi Vansnick:i will need to go in 2 minutes . other call starting
Bill Drake:never mind
Bill Drake:we can talk on the list
Nathalie Peregrine:@Bill would you like a dial out?
Bill Drake:too late Nathalie but thanks
Nathalie Peregrine:my pleasure
Stephanie Perrin:+1 vote for the IANA document
Bill Drake:I should have phoned but was trying to make this work
Brenden Kuerbis:@bill. I've had worse luck with audio in adobe, paticulraly using chrome and firefox. but safari did work, only browser that did.
Robin:Thanks, Rafik!
maria farrell:thanks rafik!
Bill Drake:safari used now Brenden
Magaly Pazello:Thank you Rafik! Bye!
Stefania Milan:Thanks Rafik!
Amr Elsadr:Bye all.
Brenden Kuerbis:thanks, be all
Marilia Maciel:bye!
Bill Drake:bon soir
Subi Chaturvedi:bye all. Thank you Rafik.
David Cake:bye all
Stephanie Perrin:bye all!
