12:59:08 From Laura Margolis UY : Hello everyone!
12:59:11 From David Mackey : Hi All
12:59:17 From Silvia Vivanco : Hello all
13:01:07 From Bill Jouris : I think the question isn't "whether Unaffiliated Individuals should not be allowed to be Members of an ALS" but whether members of an ALS can be participating as Unaffiliated Individuals. Not quite the same thing.
13:03:43 From Gopal Tadepalli : Greetings. - Dr. T V Gopal,Professor,Department of Computer Science and Engineering, College of Engineering, Guindy Campus, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
13:04:26 From Judith Hellerstein : @staff, Jonathan Zuck says he would like a call as he is in the car
13:04:51 From Michelle DeSmyter : @Judith - thank you, this is noted, I will dial out to him
13:08:31 From Judith Hellerstein : Caleb said he was also interested. I emailed him the link but possibly he could have a call out as well. Not sure what he usually does, but he seemed to not have the invitation
13:12:09 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : correct any Member can be nominated ar appointed to any thing in APRALO
13:12:11 From Maureen Hilyard : APRALO members whether they are ALS or UI Members are open to all leadership roles as individual members.
13:12:31 From Judith Hellerstein : In Naralo any one can run for a position. Although perhaps we cannot have both leadership positions filled by an individual members
13:12:59 From Judith Hellerstein : But I do not think we have had this issue before
13:14:19 From David Mackey : +1 Alan - two questions; different discussions
13:14:23 From Maureen Hilyard : Agree - lts look at each question separately
13:14:31 From Laura Margolis UY : +1
13:14:32 From Maureen Hilyard : lets
13:14:37 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : +10
13:14:53 From Matthias M. Hudobnik : good point alan!
13:15:10 From David Mackey : “+10”? you must really like Alan’s joint CLO
13:15:14 From David Mackey : point
13:15:43 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Yes indeed @David
13:16:15 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Otherwise as @Roberto is outlining we will get very muddled
13:23:57 From Seun Ojedeji : +1 @jonathan
13:29:23 From Carlos Raul Gutierrez : I will remain on the phone bridge only as of now.
13:30:02 From Gopal Tadepalli : It is usually the individual who thinks, reason and act. Individual knows how to satisfy the wants. Any group of individuals always have the potential both for order and chaos. Structuring helps in getting focus on the goals. IMHO, UIM is a structure that brings in broader perspectives from across the globe that can benefit an ALS or an Organization. - Dr. T V Gopal,Professor,Department of Computer Science and Engineering, College of Engineering, Guindy Campus, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
13:31:44 From David Mackey : no echo here
13:31:47 From Judith Hellerstein : We do not hear the echo
13:31:56 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : o echo here either
13:32:04 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : just for Alan apparently
13:32:58 From Silvia Vivanco : I think it would be useful to clearly identify what in the current model needs to be fixed. What is not working well and needs to be corrected?
13:34:03 From David Mackey : Relevant ICANN Bylaw is Section 12.d.viii
13:34:24 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : I always like to see to the "What 'harm'/ issue / problem are we trying to address question"
13:34:54 From Maureen Hilyard : +1 Cheryl and Silvia
13:35:20 From Seun Ojedeji : please can we confirm if unaffiliated members=individual members
13:35:22 From Alan Greenberg : The Bylaws do not speak of "unaffiliated". They talk about individuals.
13:35:38 From David Mackey : @Alan agreed
13:36:09 From Alan Greenberg : NARALO used the term unaffiliated for clarity in their case. It is not a magic term that we need to preserve if we do not wish to.
13:36:21 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Unaffiliated came out of the History @Alan just went through
13:36:35 From Silvia Vivanco : @Seun yes the term unaffiliated members equals individuals
13:36:43 From Nadira AL Araj : You mentioned most of the reasons.
13:36:44 From David Mackey : Thx Alan & Cheryl. I wondered where “unaffiliated” came from
13:37:07 From Gopal Tadepalli : Just to add on to my earlier comment, I agree with Alan that conflict is a rarity. So, UIM can facilitate a wider degree of possibilities both within an organization and / or ALS. UIM can enable the individual to reason it out and pool it all into ALS and / or Organization. We build Individuals who contribute to the Organization and / or ALS where they belong. - Dr. T V Gopal,Professor,Department of Computer Science and Engineering, College of Engineering, Guindy Campus, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
13:37:08 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Out of the 2007 NARAOL Rules
13:37:14 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : NARALO
13:37:28 From Bill Jouris : +1 Cheryl. The question is, What problem are we trying to solve?
13:37:51 From Bill Jouris : And how does our proposed solution address that problem?
13:38:00 From David Mackey : +1 Alan
13:38:11 From Maureen Hilyard : Everyone in At-Large is an individual member whether they entered At-Large via an ALS or registered themselves independently
13:38:20 From Seun Ojedeji : thanks at least for confirming that they are the same
13:38:22 From Natalia Filina : Hi all, sorry for being late, I thought that we haven`t a call
13:38:50 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : @Bill the only 'problem' I have ever seen in this is where previously there was barrier via any RALO Rules that stopped or inhibited anyone persons engagement
13:39:09 From Nadira AL Araj : +1 Cheryl
13:39:58 From Alan Greenberg : If we decide you can be an individual member while also being an ALS member, then the term unaffiliated no longer makes sense.
13:40:33 From Heidi Ullrich : Exactly, Alan.
13:40:43 From Heidi Ullrich : From the ICANN Bylaws:
13:40:46 From Heidi Ullrich : (B) The criteria and standards for the certification of At-Large Structures shall be established in such a way that participation by individual Internet users who are citizens or residents of countries within the Geographic Region of the RALO will predominate in the operation of each At-Large Structure within the RALO, while not necessarily excluding additional participation, compatible with the interests of the individual Internet users within the region, by others.
(C) Each RALO's Memorandum of Understanding shall also include provisions designed to allow, to the greatest extent possible, every individual Internet user who is a citizen of a country within the RALO's Geographic Region to participate in at least one of the RALO's At-Large Structures.
(D) To the extent compatible with these objectives, the criteria and standards should also afford to each RALO the type of structure that best fits the customs and character of its Geographic Region.
13:40:47 From Maureen Hilyard : +1 Alan
13:41:04 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : But that *is* the order we need to take the decisions (and make any changes) in
13:41:05 From Natalia Filina : agree with Alan too
13:41:56 From Nadira AL Araj : LACRALO doesn't have individual members
13:42:27 From Gopal Tadepalli : It is not the problem. It is a policy we are working on to enable us to specify a wider canvas of furthering the progress of "an Individual" irrespective of the affiliation if any. - Dr. T V Gopal,Professor,Department of Computer Science and Engineering, College of Engineering, Guindy Campus, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
13:42:49 From Silvia Vivanco : @Nadira LACRALO does have individual members now
13:43:19 From Silvia Vivanco : After the approval of the new rules Operating Principles and Rules of Procedure recently approved
13:43:39 From Alan Greenberg : We want people to work. We should remove as many barriers as possible.
13:43:46 From Maureen Hilyard : LAC actually do have individual members participating in At-Large, its just that they used to have to belong to an ALS, but their rules are opening it up now to non-ALS members as well
13:44:54 From Caleb Ogundele : I share your sentiments Seun
13:45:04 From Silvia Vivanco : @Nadira, kindly see the table comparing all RALO rules : https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1kmOn-v1v-5vxMGbEhIDCGWawDv134U7HTSIV57uxQjQ/edit#gid=0
13:46:01 From Alan Greenberg : What Cheryl said! That is equivalent to +100!
13:46:04 From David Mackey : @Silvia Thank you for the link
13:46:37 From Silvia Vivanco : You are welcome David, the table is also linked in this WG wiki space
13:47:07 From David Mackey : @Silvia I find the wiki space is a little confusing :-)
13:47:23 From David Mackey : @to be
13:47:23 From Silvia Vivanco : https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/Unaffiliated+Individuals+Mobilization+Working+Party
13:47:45 From Silvia Vivanco : Down below under “Other documents”
13:49:50 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : @David on our get around to do list is a review and improvement on the Wiki navigation, we may very well tap you to assist in that :-) (hopefully in 2021)
13:49:57 From David Mackey : @Sylvia do you have a link for “Operating Principles and Rules of Procedure” Is this it? https://community.icann.org/display/atlarge/Rules+of+Procedure
13:50:15 From David Mackey : @CLO yes, please let me know if I can help
13:50:32 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Excellent @David *name noted!*
13:51:33 From Gopal Tadepalli : Conceptually, Individuals are almost completely defined by the groups they come from. The language, religion, all kinds of values and other customs define an Indivdiual based on the community they come from. These things play a much bigger part in defining who an individual is. Individual for UIM is one who is keen on pooling back wider perspectives into the context of work. How does this sound ? - Dr. T V Gopal,Professor,Department of Computer Science and Engineering, College of Engineering, Guindy Campus, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
13:52:14 From Silvia Vivanco : @David the linked referenced is the ALAC ROPs
13:52:31 From Michelle DeSmyter : His line is back into the call
13:53:03 From David Mackey : @Silvia Thanks. Is there a different link for Operating Principles?
13:53:33 From Judith Hellerstein : It is fine, but we might not have staff support
13:53:51 From Alan Greenberg : Also a holiday in Canada! (but a different one - Thanksgiving).
13:54:49 From Heidi Ullrich : Next Monday will have staff support. ICANN69 begins on Tuesday, 13 October.
13:55:12 From Judith Hellerstein : @heidi it is columbus day which is a US holiday
13:55:42 From Heidi Ullrich : Yes, but not an ICANN holiday staff holiday and we also have staff in Europe.
13:55:57 From David Mackey : I may not be here next week. If not, I’ll see everyone in three weeks.
13:56:00 From Silvia Vivanco : @David that link includes all ALAC rules, the RALOs rules are in the Excel table provided before
13:56:19 From David Mackey : @Silvia, right. txh
13:56:21 From David Mackey : thx
13:56:21 From Heidi Ullrich : I do note that next Monday is Canadian Thanksgiving.
13:56:28 From Judith Hellerstein : Yes it is there on the wiki
13:57:46 From Michelle DeSmyter : I will have it posted shortly after today’s meeting
13:57:58 From David Mackey : Bye All
13:58:05 From Hanan khatib : hank you all
13:58:05 From Silvia Vivanco : Thank you all
13:58:08 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Thanks everyone Bye for now then...
13:58:11 From Natalia Filina : thank you Roberto and all!
13:58:11 From Matthias M. Hudobnik : thx and bye bye ;-)!
13:58:11 From Silvia Vivanco : Bye and have a nice day
13:58:11 From Seun Ojedeji : bye
13:58:14 From Judith Hellerstein : Bye all
13:58:23 From Sarah Kiden : Bye
13:58:30 From Gopal Tadepalli : Thank You. - Dr. T V Gopal,Professor,Department of Computer Science and Engineering, College of Engineering, Guindy Campus, Anna University, Chennai, INDIA
13:59:19 From Bill Jouris : Columbus Day is mostly a real holiday only if you work for the government. Otherwise (private sector) it is ignored
