Zoom Chat: 2020-04-29 Consolidated Policy Working Group Call

13:18:22 From Claudia Ruiz : Welcome to the Consolidated Policy Working Group Call
13:25:59 From Claudia Ruiz : https://www.streamtext.net/player?event=ICANN [streamtext.net]
13:28:52 From Evin Erdoğdu : Hello all, welcome.
13:28:55 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Yes
13:29:00 From sergio salinas porto LACRALO : hi everyone!
13:30:37 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Hi Sergio
13:31:07 From sergio salinas porto LACRALO : hi cheryl :-D
13:31:23 From Heidi Ullrich : Hi, All.
13:31:25 From Michel TCHONANG : Hi all
13:33:52 From Claudia Ruiz : https://www.streamtext.net/player?event=ICANN [streamtext.net]
13:35:28 From Michelle DeSmyter : @Sergio - I will check on the dial out status for you
13:35:50 From sergio salinas porto LACRALO : ok thanks Michelle
13:37:39 From sergio salinas porto LACRALO : I'm already on the call
13:37:49 From sergio salinas porto LACRALO : thanks Claudia and Michelle!
13:38:56 From Jonathan Zuck : That’s right
13:39:07 From Evin Erdoğdu : Will do
13:40:20 From Alan Greenberg : For EPDP presentation on the Public Comment on the Addendum, I had sent the wrong doc to staff. Correct one now sent (PowerPoint)
13:40:39 From Justine Chew : @Holly, I don't know why we don't have a pre-"Drafting" status - something like "Review" . :)
13:42:28 From sergio salinas porto LACRALO to Claudia Ruiz (Privately) : I'm already on the call
13:43:08 From Holly Raiche : Good point - it was part of what I was thinking
13:43:22 From sergio salinas porto LACRALO to Claudia Ruiz (Privately) : sorry I fell off the call
13:43:43 From Holly Raiche : @ Justine - I had in the back of my mind the question Ricardo asked
13:43:46 From Maureen Hilyard (ALAC) : Yes definitely needs discussion to clarify what is policy and what isn't !
13:44:10 From Maureen Hilyard (ALAC) : And it is the Operations, Finance and Budget Subcommittee
13:45:44 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : appreciate you doing so @Justine timely input is appreciated by SubPro
13:46:15 From Holly Raiche : So my question - maybe confirmed by OCL/JZ off-line that I don’t present to the CPWG next w eek, but do some dot points for the FBsubcommittee??
13:48:17 From davekissoondoyal : Hello everyone.. Sorry for being late…had issues of connection
13:48:22 From Holly Raiche : @JZ - in the CCT report, did it make recommendations to changes in the 2013 RAA?
13:49:02 From Jonathan Zuck : @Holly, yes there were recommendations, particularly in the area of DNS Abuse that required changes to the RAA
13:49:35 From Jonathan Zuck : The whole PIC thing needs some real work to be. functional
13:50:11 From Holly Raiche : @JZ - so maybe as part of our DNS Abuse campaign, we need to recommend changes to the RAA?
13:50:27 From Holly Raiche : (and the Registry agreements)
13:51:33 From Holly Raiche : (failing changes to the RA/RAAs, an agreed set of guidelines??)
13:53:04 From Holly Raiche : (and I think PICs will be part of Justine’s presentation)
13:55:15 From Jonathan Zuck : We went back and forth on this and ended up deciding we couldn’t come up with a formal recommendation on “parking.”
13:56:56 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : This "not coming up with a formal recommendation" problem has been ongoing forever; it is a standard tactic to keep the domain name space as free trading as possible.
13:57:31 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : From the point of view of an end user, domain "investment" restricts the availability of domain name offerings and pushes prices up
13:57:59 From Holly Raiche : Agree with OCL
13:58:06 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : That is what SubPro focusses on Top Level Only
13:58:29 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : Now "squatting of TLDs" at the top level is another level I had not thought about.
13:58:51 From Holly Raiche : I took this to be about ‘parking’
13:58:51 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : I don't believe you did look at TLDs in relation to these terms
13:59:06 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : at least not that I notices IN reading the report (several times)
13:59:15 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : How can one "squat" on top level domains? I thought they paid for it?
13:59:22 From Marita Moll : what is the difference between parking and squatting
13:59:30 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : SO Sub Pro is not ignoring"CCT-RT IMO
13:59:41 From Jonathan Zuck : Parking is traditionally a reference to second level domains, @Marita
14:00:10 From Holly Raiche : It’s really a competition issue - is it of concern to us
14:00:21 From Jonathan Zuck : and @squatting is as well and generally refers to trademarked domains. This is a whole new vocabulary with regards to top level domains
14:00:24 From Justine Chew : It was "ignore" in inverted commas
14:01:40 From Jonathan Zuck : This is people investing $185k and paying ICANN a minimum of $25k per year to warehouse a top level domain. That feels like a new concept, albeit potentially important
14:02:20 From Roberto : \@JZ and in deciding vocabulary, we need to try to be objective and not using terms that are loaded with emotions (and judgement)
14:02:32 From Jonathan Zuck : indeed
14:02:33 From Justine Chew : Can we keep on point please?
14:02:49 From Alan Greenberg : YES PLEASE!!!!!!!!!!!
14:02:50 From Holly Raiche : Remember, in China, new TLDs became an object of speculation - like tulips in HOlland
14:03:39 From Jonathan Zuck : Yes but that was NOT TLDs but second level domains within the new gTLD space. I’m not aware of ANY warehousing of first level strings themselves but I’m not sure about it
14:03:53 From Judith Hellerstein : Sorry I was late, coming off another meeting
14:04:04 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : PLease note that as the text shows, that SubPro WG could not "come to agreement on definitions for"for these terms
14:04:50 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Exactly @Alan it is a Nul
14:07:32 From Greg Shatan : Marita’s point is still valid — this is merely rhetoric at this point.
14:08:00 From Jonathan Zuck : THAT’s NOT a TLD!
14:09:10 From Jonathan Zuck : A TLD .PHOTOS, not Zuck.PHOTOS. This REALLY isn’t an issue. It’s REALLY expensive to warehouse a top level string
14:09:15 From Marita Moll : so the term use does not mean "use" in the sense it is usually meant.
14:09:27 From Jonathan Zuck : Exactly, @Justine
14:09:54 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : gTLD use remains as delegation and meeting contractual requirements and content obligations
14:10:40 From Alan Greenberg : USe for a TLD is equivalent (at a minimum) to "parked" for a 2nd level domain.
14:10:41 From Jonathan Zuck : The existing agreements DO NOT have sufficient clauses for enforcement
14:11:02 From Jonathan Zuck : ok
14:11:33 From Jonathan Zuck : thats what I’m saying. They do not
14:11:57 From Holly Raiche : And PICs - and their ‘enforceabiliy’ is part of that issue
14:13:54 From Holly Raiche : This issue has two parts - what Compliance could do - and doesn’t, and what the RA/TAA does not cover - but should
14:14:01 From Claudia Ruiz : About Contractual Compliance: https://www.icann.org/resources/pages/compliance -2012-02-25-en
14:14:23 From Jonathan Zuck : what’s the question here?
14:15:20 From Jonathan Zuck : The current rec seems fine. We’ll just need more, that’s all
14:15:39 From Marita Moll : Not backfiring at all. We are considering it @justine
14:16:11 From Jonathan Zuck : We SHOULD note that this SHOULD be addressed by the WG
14:16:28 From Holly Raiche : Only the third looks problematic - it touches on the PICs issues
14:19:31 From christopher wilkinson : Premium pricing is a major issue. The Rent of a ‘good’ domain should accrue to the Registrant. The idea that the Registry controls the price of SLDs just confirms the lack of regulation and the weakness of competitive conditions.
14:19:34 From Marita Moll : @Justine -- maybe there are layers of "use" that are not dealt with here. What is there is a minimal form of use -- and maybe should be identified as such. Maybe that could be a possible wording change suggestion
14:20:22 From Marita Moll : -- a small motion forward
14:24:41 From Alan Greenberg : We will provide a pointer to the Legal memo.
14:25:12 From Claudia Ruiz to Harold Arcos (Privately) : Estas en la linea?
14:29:31 From Alan Greenberg : Should be slide #5
14:33:00 From Jonathan Zuck : That would be interesting
14:33:23 From Jonathan Zuck : Isn’t part of the problem that we are simply outvoted on things like legal vs natural? Is it worth discussing if we know how it will turn out?
14:34:24 From Justine Chew : Not public yet
14:35:18 From Justine Chew : Do we need our own backup statement?
14:35:33 From Maureen Hilyard (ALAC) : Im listening...
14:35:58 From Herb Waye : I have to leave the call, nice hearing everyone’s voices. Stay safe.
14:36:07 From Holly Raiche : Thanks Hadia - and Alan - if you could circulate the new information - or a summary - that would be very helpful
14:36:17 From Claudia Ruiz : Thank you, Herb
14:36:35 From Maureen Hilyard (ALAC) : Bye Herb
14:37:00 From Justine Chew : @Alan, great!
14:37:15 From Holly Raiche : Thanks Alan
14:37:25 From Hadia Elminiawi : @Holly I can send you the legal memo
14:37:40 From Holly Raiche : That would be great Hadia- thanks
14:37:50 From Michel TCHONANG : Good
14:37:58 From Justine Chew : I've seen the "current" one and support it. But will look out for an updated one.
14:38:18 From Yrjo Lansipuro : Alan and Hadia, very happy for the ALAC/GAC alignment
14:38:25 From Greg Shatan : Reminder that we have presentation on RPM Comments which are due May 4. :-)
14:44:47 From Hadia Elminiawi : @Yrjo yes Alan has been championing this
14:45:16 From Judith Hellerstein : As usual the sessions are running late, that is the typical issue. I had to wait 4 times to get to the front
14:48:13 From Jonathan Zuck : That DOES seem worse. I think we need to accept this
14:48:48 From Bill Jouris : I don't think we can accept a design which effectively allows a single stakeholder group to veto motion.
14:48:50 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : on a if needs be basis perhaps
14:49:10 From Jonathan Zuck : The chance for evolution!
14:49:52 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : But that IS the GNSO model of course a
14:50:04 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Exactly @Greg
14:50:20 From Holly Raiche : Are with Greg on this
14:50:27 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Move forward with warnings and an abundance of caution
14:50:44 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Either
14:51:29 From Justine Chew : Accept with protest; with questions on possibility of failing to achieve goal.
14:52:02 From Marita Moll : +1 @Justine
14:52:17 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : Thank you for this discussion, Alan and Hadia. Clearly this is really important and there are some really serious issues on the table.
14:52:43 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : I guess we all wish we had much more time to discuss these issues.
14:53:17 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : May I ask all participants in the call to follow-up on the EPDP Phase 2 by email on the mailing list?
14:53:26 From Alan Greenberg : Of course, when the GNSO charters the group, we will have NO say in how we and the other ACs are represented. And we know on the EPDP, even out Liaison was not allowed to participate in the decision.
14:53:32 From Alfredo Calderon : =! @Justine, to accept with protest, with questions on possibility of failing to meet the proposed goal.
14:53:41 From Jonathan Zuck : pretty template
14:53:48 From Fouad Bajwa : :)
14:54:03 From Fouad Bajwa : Don't worry, 7 mins are still good
14:54:09 From Hadia Elminiawi : agree pretty template
14:54:13 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : We often run over time in this call @Greg
14:54:20 From Jonathan Zuck : You can go over Greg…a LITTLE bit
14:55:57 From Justine Chew : @Alfredo, agreed with one amendment => to accept with protest, with questions on possibility of failing to meet the chartered goal.
14:56:40 From Alfredo Calderon : @Justine, agree on your amendment.
14:58:17 From Holly Raiche : NEXT SLIDE PLEASE
14:58:21 From Ricardo Holmquist : sorry, will have to leave
14:58:29 From Ricardo Holmquist : have a good day
14:58:43 From Alfredo Calderon : You too, @Ricardo.
14:58:47 From Holly Raiche : PLEASE - NEXT SLIDE
15:02:56 From Marita Moll : missed something on slide 18
15:03:13 From Marita Moll : at the bottom
15:04:51 From Holly Raiche : Next slide??
15:05:45 From Holly Raiche : There was a question on 183 - that raised an issue?
15:06:19 From Harold Arcos to Claudia Ruiz (Privately) : la primera vez llamaron rápido :S sabes si hay alguna restricción de llamadas por canal ES EN o FR??
15:06:40 From Laurin W : have to run, apologies and be safe all.
15:06:48 From Holly Raiche : We did agree to the 2014 RAA
15:06:55 From Holly Raiche : sorry - 2013
15:08:56 From Holly Raiche : Can we make those suggestions?
15:09:00 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : All good points @Greg I heard nothing I would not support in your presentation/tour
15:09:07 From Jonathan Zuck : sounds good
15:09:57 From Jonathan Zuck : Thick is dead
15:10:33 From Holly Raiche : Happy with the recommendations
15:11:19 From Alan Greenberg : I need to leave now. Thanks all.
15:11:19 From Olivier Crépin-Leblond : My hair is starting to look like Beyoncé's as it's growing longer :-)
15:11:53 From Judith Hellerstein : Do we have an extension?
15:11:54 From Justine Chew : Comment period ends 4 May
15:12:38 From Jonathan Zuck : Yes, but we need to push back on artificial deadlines
15:13:38 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Strat Plan should be O,FB-SC surely
15:13:49 From Fouad Bajwa : yes heavy material today....
15:13:59 From Judith Hellerstein : Did they fix it and add at large to it
15:14:01 From Fouad Bajwa : meeting is 3:13am here in Pakistan :)
15:14:24 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Noting there is errata in the Consensus PlayBook that needs fixing (omissions od ALAC and SSAC references
15:14:46 From Claudia Ruiz : 6 May 13:00 UTC
15:14:49 From Alfredo Calderon : Stay safe and well.
15:14:51 From Fouad Bajwa : Wonderful. Take care all of you and please keep safe!!!
15:14:58 From Evin Erdoğdu : Thank you all!
15:15:04 From Greg Shatan : No mulling on RPMs.....
15:15:04 From Michel TCHONANG : oK Claudia thank you
15:15:11 From Fouad Bajwa : Thank you staff and interpreters!!!
15:15:11 From Tracy Hackshaw : bye all. stay safe
15:15:12 From Cheryl Langdon-Orr : Bye for now
15:15:13 From Roberto : Bye
15:15:14 From Hadia Elminiawi : bye
15:15:16 From Fouad Bajwa : goodnight/goodmorning
15:15:18 From Sarah Kiden : Thank you
15:15:18 From Michel TCHONANG : THANK YOU ALL BYE
15:15:19 From Greg Shatan : Bye all!
15:15:20 From avri doria : thanks, stay well all.
15:15:22 From Abdeldjalil Bachar Bong : bye